Racists in Northern Ireland

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 14:04

I'm ashamed to report some of my countrymen have behaved abominably.



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/8104287.stm



Luckily, a cross spectrum of all "tribes" politicians have condemned this.

blinky



Joined: 07/12/2008
Posts: 187

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 14:40

Its been on radio also..., totaly unacceptable

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 17:37

Where are all our closet racist BNP supporters when we need them? They had plenty to say against eastern Europeans in the UK last week.

Although it's good to see McGuinness speaking out against this, considering the number of people burned out of their homes at the behest of his old organisation and the other lot.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 17:57

Dear ILC



re msg 3



I'm ashamed to say - although it is not confirmed - that the perpetrators are likely to consider themselves to be "Loyalists" - believing N.Ireland is for Brits only...



I wish those believing that could have walked the streets of the mainland at the height of the troubles - when most folk wanted Ireland - all of it - floated out into the Atlantic and "sunk" .... There are any folk who wouldn't consider these "loyalists" to BE British .. and I'm ashamed if they think they speak for me.. they most CERTAINLY don't



http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Romanians-forced-out-of-homes.5372429.jp

PaddyPower1


Joined: 28/05/2009
Posts: 13

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 18:53

Sorry MMMMM, I dont agree that most people wanted ALL of Ireland to float away! I for one do wish that your beloved 'Ulster' complete with Nationalists and Unionists would dissappear forever!

Tony

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 18:59

Its a mystery as to why these Romanian people were targeted , when there are so many immigrants all over Ireland

Simbas

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 19:34

Dear PaddyPower1 - Tony

re msg 5

I must have a very different memory than yours ... the folk on the mainland - back then - didn't make the distinction - Ireland - including N.Irish... it was all a "problem"... I spend much of my teenage years trying to convince my peers that "*I* wasn't Irish - I was British" - and it wasn't *my* tribe blowing up soldiers... " I think I'd remember if an Englishman said - "I wish they'd float Ireland - but just the northern bit - off into the Atlantic"... ))



As to my "beloved" Ulster [ note the change of inverted commas - as Ulster is - as we both know - a PROVINCE - and is incorrectly oft used as N. Ireland ... ;) ] I have very little time for nationalist fervour of any kind due to lines drawn on a map by Politicians or Generals.

I was married to an Irish ( Father from Co.Clare ) Catholic girl - and now to a Russian - I've lived in CY and heard too much small minded ignorance... some of it uttered by myself... before I knew better.:(

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 19:38

Dear Simbas



re msg 6



When the Irish ( Eire) economy was booming - the Celtic Tiger - loads of Latvians came to work in the fields - Poles came to work in the booming building industry..



During "the troubles" not many non Irish - folk WANTED to live in Eire or N.I. - in fact it was a DODDLE to get an Irish passport... even *I* got one



The "Welcome mat" got pulled a long time ago.... Eire is one of the worse implementers - with the UK - of EU Immigration Directives.

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 19:48

MM wrote: "As to my "beloved" Ulster [ note the change of inverted commas - as Ulster is - as we both know - a PROVINCE - and is incorrectly oft used as N. Ireland ... ;) ] I have very little time for nationalist fervour of any kind due to lines drawn on a map by Politicians or Generals."

Hear hear, Sir!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 20:21

Dear Simbas



re msg 6



Having just watched the six o'clock news .. I THINK I have a simplistic answer..



Some Protestants have thought it would be a "great idea" to beat up a few Catholic Poles at a football match... N.Ireland v Poland.. it isn't too extreme a jump to assume all Eastern Europeans are therefore Catholic - some of these bigots aren't too bright - and after all they would be "stealing jobs"..



Combine this with a bit of "help" from extremist nationalists from the mainland... I mean the Romanians are "dark skinned" AND "Catholics".. what a "terrible thing"...



The ironic thing was hearing Martin McGuinness asking folk to report the perpetrators of violence and intimidation to the Police... Things HAVE moved on...

littlejohn


Joined: 09/03/2009
Posts: 316

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 23:40

Many Ms - message 7, I think I have had similar experiences to yourself. But please don,t spoil it by commenting on current politicians.

Give peace a chance, despite them ( none of them have anything to be proud of ) and don't give the extremists any ammunition to continue their pointless sectarianism.

The morons responsible for this most recent outrage are the offspring of the thugs who helped blight my life as a youngster and caused me to leave Ireland

Best regards

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 01:23

Bullies, gangsters and low life, such a thorn in the side of society.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 10:47

Hi LJ



re msg 11



Sorry - my comment re M McG was NOT meant to be derogatory-I can see why you would think so..:( ..



I voted YES to peace- and hope Cypriots can one day vote to look to the future, too. ( The Irelands had quite a few initiatives fail before the Good Friday Agreement..)



Mark

dozza67


Joined: 11/07/2008
Posts: 607

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 11:10

There is absolutely no excuse for what was done to these people. No good blaming just the Irish, there are racists everywhere and bullies. Why don't they pick on someone who can fight back. Cowards, all of them, hiding behind face coverings while throwing stones at windows and abusing women and children. Don't just blame the Irish for this, It's the thin end of the wedge.

whitemad


Joined: 26/05/2007
Posts: 44

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 13:03

My hubby is a N Ireland supporter and travels the world to see them. The incident at the match referred to was NOT racist against the Catholic Polish supporters. It started when Polish supporters (football thugs not living in N Ireland) fought among each other and destroyed two pub/restaurants in Belfast - they then attacked inocent people en route to the match and were determined to fight with the local supporters. The Romanian incident was carried out by thugs (you get them everywhere in UK) who didn't represent any decent N Ireland people - it was not religion led as a lot of the Romanians attended the local Presbetyrian church. We have many friends Catholic, Protestant, Polish, Bulgarian, Russian etc and we all live in harmony and enjoy each others company. It's not all about Catholic/Protestant divide any longer - the majority live together very amicably - we have come a long way!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 16:06

Hi Whitemad



re msg 15



Thanks for the heads up.. re the Romanians / Poles



My "theory" re the violence comes from what I saw on the news and some info that mainland UK right wing extremist groups have formed strong links with some extreme "loyalist" paramilitary supporters.



When you see footage of the Polish guys being attacked on a bridge over the Lagan the N.I. folk are plainly "loyalists" - ( Tatooes / flags !) .



I'm aware that there is a sort of vacuum for those who might be out of work and looking for someone to blame These poor folk seem to be the "easy target :(

whitemad


Joined: 26/05/2007
Posts: 44

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 20:03

I understand where you were coming from - the news does not always project the reality of situations. The thugs could well have been so called 'loyalist supporters' on that occasion. They were not at the football match and appeared after hearing about the trouble. Nonetheless they were thugs and were not attacking for 'religious' reasons. They were attacking because they could and wanted to. These same thugs could and would attack any groups (including innocent locals out for a night out) - always in a pack, never alone. These types of thugs are driven by violence and can be from all communities.



I have no doubt any paramilitary supporter will have very dubious links - after all they have always ignored the law of the land and showed no respect for human life. Let's not brand these 'characters' as loyalists - they do not represent any loyalists I know in N Ireland.



M

racoonchic



Joined: 17/11/2008
Posts: 3223

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 21:59

happens every were not just in my country disgusting as my wife is also russian happens in cyprus but we dont comment on that because we cant read the turkish or greek news reports

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 22:12

6m's people like you keep the bigotry in N.I. and the ROC alive I really hope you are proud of yourself!

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 22:14

The problem with Northern Ireland is that it is to close to Scotland with all its bigots and thugs exporting their hatred to my country, something i have had to live with all my life.



There is no lasting solution to the Northern Irish problem unless you find some way of moving all the Orange men and Republicans somewhere like Siberia.



God only knows why anyone would want to choose there to move to stay voluntarily, one can only presume the Romanians had never heard of the kind of so called human beings that inhabit that Province.

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 22:31

6 m's call me niave if you want but surely the area this took place in is not a so called "loyalist" area?

paddywack


Joined: 04/05/2009
Posts: 959

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 22:44

Karakum5c

I moved to N.Ireland volantarily 6 years ago,and all I have encountered is friendliness from both sides of the so called divide.

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 22:48

Lets face it.



The sectarian thugs that attacked the Romanian families are probably looking for a bit of diversion from their usual targets.



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/foyle_and_west/8067198.stm



The whole society is poisoned by hatred of anyone different, not helped by the separate schooling system



that entrenches tribalism and not diversity.



Horrible place, horrible people, who would feel perfectly home in the US Deep South in the 1950s with harsh

guttural German sounding accents.



Mix in a religious bigotry worthy of the Taliban and the result is N.Ireland.



Lem

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 22:53

Lemtich

totally unfair comments, Nice places , nice people, or at least the majority are on both sides. Have you ever been there or are you just another media junkie reading all you can and believing it.

Seperate schooling systems are in place all over the UK are they not????????????????????

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:07

I grew up in Northern Ireland between 1959 to 1970, I lived in Coleraine where the poor guy got killed, I actually lived at 22 Buskin Way in the Heights. I went to Inst CAI, my mother's family are all N. Irish from Belfast, Wigton Street, between the Shankill and the Falls Road.



I lived amongst this lot for 11 years as an English born youth and detested their small minded tribal bigotry, and don't give me separate schooling systems being all over UK. My children went to schools in England where both Catholic and Protestant children attended without some sort of tribal loyalty test being conducted by their peers.



The countryside is great, the society poisoned by sectarian hatred, try getting stopped by a gang on the way home from school and asked if you were a Catholic or a Protestant.



I tried,"I'm a Jew".



Confusion all around, until I was asked,



"Are ye a Catholic Jew or a Protestant Jew?"



Great people until they find out what foot you kick with.



Lem

paddywack


Joined: 04/05/2009
Posts: 959

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:10

Lemtich,

If your post is`nt racist what is.

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:20

Paddywack my sentiments exactly.

Lemtich i said "separate schooling systems are in place all over the Uk are they not"

key words being all over the UK.

Glasgow I believe now has schools where no Glaswegan kids are allowed because of religion and not RC or Protestant.

Furthermore when I was growing up in Scotland only kids that were RC were permitted to go to Catholic schools whereas anyone no matter colour or crede were permitted to go to 'state' schools.

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:20

Paddywack. What defines an inhabitant of Northern Ireland as being of a separate race?



They are not a race, though they seem to have more than their fair share of Neanderthals, they are a community.



I have defined them as a community that is poisoned by tribalism, sectarianism and religious bigotry from first hand knowledge,



You call my posting racist.



Is it because I am black?



Lem

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:24

Lemtich

Maybe you should spend some time out of the sun and maybe pale your skin!!!!! (joke)

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:25

Re separate schooling, I'm talking about England, not Scotland, and especially not Glasgow. Every 12th July every other Orange Band seemed to have come from across the water.



The Scots have just the same problem with religion that their counterparts in Ireland have.



No one believes in it but it doesn't have help give a sense of identity that wants you to reject, fight and kill someone else for being different.



Lem

phylray



Joined: 21/09/2007
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:27

I have taught in both schools in Scotland and there are now some non RC attending

for various reasons. Sometimes, unfortunately, it is because of behaviour problems in

their non-sectarian schools.

Bigotry here, I would say, is mostly a city thing.

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:29

I'm off to choir practice now.



So how's about ye?



Words to chill my soul when spoken in Norn.



I think I'd rather holiday in Hellmund than Antrim.



Happy Days



Lem

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:43

Lemtich and others,

this thread started about attacks on Romanians in Belfast (shockin) but you and others tried to twist it until it nearly became a political bigotry Protestant /Catholic thread. Yeh sh.t happened in NI it happened here it happens every day all over the world but it is only small minded people that keep the bigotry / racism alive.



Finally Lemtich get the boulder of your shoulder it's all over now except for the SMALL minority who want to keep it alive.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:48

Dear nurseawful



re 28/30



When you are on the same page as me - and have actually READ my posts properly - we can talk...



>>6m's people like you keep the bigotry in N.I. and the ROC alive I really hope you are proud of yourself!<<



Can you try and explain how you managed label me a bigot !!!... I am a "Prod" who married to an RC girl - despite bigoted comments from many folk on both sides of the "family".. Some of my best friends "kick with the left foot"..



In CY I was called a "Turk Lover" because I holidayed in TR or "TRNC" and regularly crossed backwards and forwards...



I guess you just joined the "club" of "one dimensional thinkers" - that is being polite ..



>>6 m's call me niave if you want but surely the area this took place in is not a so called "loyalist" area?<<



OK, "naive" .. Do you mean the attacks on Poles, Romanians... ?



Do TRY and READ this post properly - BEFORE -replying

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
18/06/2009 23:49

re 17



'nuff said - in total agreement..

newscoop


Joined: 23/12/2007
Posts: 2197

Message Posted:
19/06/2009

6m; I think you`ll find that the majority of Romanians are orthodox.



You know, that religion that promotes peace and tranquility wherever it is given free reign.



Places like Serbia, Bulgaria, Russia, and of course ROC.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 00:03

Hi Lem



re 26/29/31/33



I'm sad when you talk about N.I the way you do - but I recognise many of things you mention - all too well



When my Nauny's were still alive - I went "home" more often than now and I still saw the occasional lapses of tribalism - but saw more signs of reparation and progress.



Veta - on her first and only trip last year - sadly only for the day - to attend a funeral - loved the place and the people she met.



I took her to places I wouldn't have ventured NEAR 20 years ago and thought Belfast was fantastic..although it seemed so SMALL..



The Antrim Coast is one of my fav places in the world - and - if you remember - my Dad went to your school ! ( he hated it - at first - he was a boarder)



I remember coming to live in England in '72 and finding it SO different - I missed many things - I rarely encountered ethnic crap- I lived in "mixer town" - Holywood - only 5 miles from Belfast - and my best friends were RCs who were taught a different "history" th

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 00:22

6mm's

I apologise if I have READ you wrong but fact you brought up in message 4 'that the perpatrators are likely to consider themselves loyalists' ( maybe not exact words) the thread started of I believe about the attacks on Romanians. Again if I am wrong no doubt you will correct me but in the 2 links (msg 1&4) you provided the word loyalist was not mentioned

YOU

started this thread about the attacks on the Romanians not me, but you then helped to turn it into a political NI thread. Yes the attacks took place, not nice, in fact appalling but again you mentioned the word loyalist not me.

The fact that you have to mention your religion (Prod!!) and that you were married to a girl of a different religion, and you have friends that kick with a different foot is of no relevence as far as I am concerned friends are friends and I do not need to know their religion! so why mention it at all.

For the record you don't have to be polite to me & I would be delighted 2 talk anytime.

fairy



Joined: 30/11/2008
Posts: 40

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 01:54

Re mess 39.

Here here..I say. I am a country lady of Mmms and I agree with what you have pointed out nurseawful, but in defence of mmm(like he needs it!) I understand his use of certain language. It is very hard to leave behind a certain part of where you come from, especially coming from such a passionate and emotionaly charged upbringing as we had in northern Ireland.

Bigots and Racists should not be tolerated anywhere.

whitemad


Joined: 26/05/2007
Posts: 44

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 11:36

Hey Lem - I feel your pain - but we have moved on from those dark days. I grew up witnessing things a child so never have witnessed. But I can assure you that the majority of people in N Ireland are certainly not what you have described and your suggestion that we are is nothing less than offensive. My son has always gone to mixed and integrated schools. He sees no difference between Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Muslim etc. His friends are mixed from all races and religions. He's 17 now and knows nothing of the 'troubles' or the bigatory which once ravished our country. I agree integrated education is the best way forward.

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 11:52

nurseawful,

I hope you were better at understanding your patients than fellow BB members. Rarely have I seen anyone get someone so wrong as you did with MM. I've never met the bloke but from being on the same forums for years I can assure you that few people preach tolerance and equality more than he does. What were you thinking of?

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 15:43

Dear Newscoop



re msg 6



>>I think you`ll find that the majority of Romanians are orthodox.

<<



Yep - about 85%



>>that religion that promotes peace and tranquility wherever it is given free reign. <<



The one from which Christianity evolved - yes !



>> Serbia, Bulgaria, Russia, and of course ROC.<<



You forgot Armenia, Georgia, Greece, Albania, Macedonia, Ukraine, Moldovia ....



Are you now suggesting Orthodoxy means people who are racist?

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 18:09

Whitemad. Message 40 and Mark. Message 37



I wholly withdraw my comments about the majority of N. Irish people.



I do have some bitter memories, living there as an English youth meant I belonged to neither side and so had the brunt of prejudice from both.



They were voiced in a moment of bitterness.



Lem

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 21:02

"They were voiced in a moment of bitterness."



As in, too many bitters?

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 21:38

ilovekibris



I don't drink bitter, mate.



I drink Strongbow.



Did you ever live in Northern Ireland?



Lem

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
19/06/2009 23:59

Hi Lem



re msg 43



No need to apologise.. sadly ..I knew where you were coming from... some "fossils" still to be found... but rarer ;)



Nurseawful



re 38 - I think one of us needs to lie down in a dark room and contemplate what one of us is capable of reading into another's post ! ;)

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
20/06/2009 00:58

Jealously

Romanian Women are attractive and the Men know how to work hard, long hours without complaint!



Richaed

steg63


Joined: 08/02/2007
Posts: 11

Message Posted:
20/06/2009 03:25

Hi Lem

Can also understand your frustration but please don't tar us all with the same brush. Things have moved on since you where last there and although it may not be perfect it has come a long way from those bad days in the 70s. I lived in London for a few years in the 70s with my parents who moved there to escape the troubles.

Like yourself i experienced prejudice only because i was Irish and what people seen and heard on the news but it hasn't left me with any bitterness. I'm not a racist and what happened to those Romanians makes me ashamed and saddened like the vast majority of decent people in N Ireland.