MEDAL GIVEN BY GREEK CYPRIOTS AS BRIBE (How corrupt is the ECJ?)

twaddle


Joined: 06/07/2008
Posts: 245

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 11:47

The "Greek-Greek Cypriot" bribe came out of the historic decision of the European Court of Justice, the biggest judicial organ in the European Union (EU). The court put the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus (TRNC) under the sovereignty of the Greek Cypriot judiciary. The British Supreme Court sent a property case filed by Greek Cypriots in London regarding a house in Girne, TRNC to the Court of Justice of the European Communities. This was what the Greek Cypriots wanted because the judge was Vasilis Skouris of Greece. Skouris was invited to the Greek Cypriot administration in 2006, and he was granted a medal of honor for his services to the Greek Cypriot people. Also, Skouris and his family was hosted in the island in 2006 and 2008. The court ruled that Greek Cypriot courts can make decisions about not only property but also commercial and social issues regarding the TRNC, and the decisions would be valid throughout the EU.



Source: http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/english/domestic/1194

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 11:53

Well there you go, just need more info regarding these corrupt individuals who think they are 'untouchables'! but all will be unveiled gradually to the advantage of N.C. Just like our M.P situation now.

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 11:54

Who writes this racist, paranoid drivel and why can't they accept they lost and international law won? Therer are none so blind...

twaddle


Joined: 06/07/2008
Posts: 245

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:08

Why is it racist? If it is true it clearly demonstrates that there is a problem with the ECJ in that it has allowed the chief judge on the panel to sit in on a case that he has strong links with and therefore a clear conflict of interest. In the UK, it would be considered to be an unsatisfactory and unsafe ruling!

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:16

Oh got out the bed the wrong side again did we ILK? never mind go get your dummy,.



Why do you condemn every thing that is not to your pleasing ILK?

do you need a councellor? I think you do?



As I tell my small grandchildren, look at all things, dont condemn, as you dont know if all or any is true or false until such time!!

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:20

Twaddle you are so right, as things come to light gradually a good lawyer/barrister is going to have a field day picking up on these corrupt issues.

paddywack


Joined: 04/05/2009
Posts: 959

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:33

dizzycows

Not in my lifetime.

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:37

Possibly so, no one really knows do they

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:37

Let us put these things into perspective. I did not expect anything else from ECJ. The objective of ECJ is to make sure that European Union ends up as one united country. ROC is a member of EU and their priority is to uphold the rights of member countries.



Let me give you one of their early decisions to demonstrate my point about unity. In Germany the alcoholic drinks have to contain a minimum level of alcohol, otherwise it is illegal to produce or market them in Germany. In Italy they produced some alcoholic drinks with lower levels of alcohol and it was all legal in Italy. The GErman courts banned the import of such drinks from Italy because it was against the German laws. The matter eventually went to ECJ and they ruled that if the product is legally produced in one member country, it can be legally distributed and sold in all member countries. This case demonstrated şn a nutshell the duties of ECJ. So nothing unusual with their decision ref. Orams. However the final result in UK will be in favour of Orams and I have reasoned this out many times in the past. Let us wait and see.

ismet

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:49

ismet you are soooo right, thanks for your input as usual so good lol

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 12:54

Dizzycows,

Your compliments and your name make me go all dizzy

ismet

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 14:12

Yep, thats me, always very busy, blonde and can do, as they say.

Still running a big business etc and draw my pension, but get stopped for fraud re age!!! good isnt it.

Well, we got to blow our own trumpet some times eh lol

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 14:39

Dear Ismet



it is very "convenient" that the "TRNC"Villaowners board was wiped clean - as I seem to remember you and I chewed the fat on this one - regarding Judge Jack's incorrect -possibly politically influenced - interpretation of Protocol 10 - of the Cyprus Green Line regulations in relation to it's accession and the suspending of the acquis north of the Green Line.



For the decision to go in favour of the Orams - remember even Judge Jacks says they are in breach of the Cyprus law - it's only about the enforcing ... the Court of England and Wales is going to have to find another legal reason not to enforce.



I told you then - and I maintain my stance - that you will ultimately be proved incorrect - and the Courts of England and Wales may again "stall", but the case will end up ultimately with a ruling for enforcement - if there is no settlement in the interim - which is what the UK hopes for - they don't WANT the "hot potato" !

twaddle


Joined: 06/07/2008
Posts: 245

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 17:34

Mark, ref Message 13

"For the decision to go in favour of the Orams - remember even Judge Jacks says they are in breach of the Cyprus law - it's only about the enforcing ... the Court of England and Wales is going to have to find another legal reason not to enforce"

Surely this is part of the problem. The ECJ makes their judgement on the basis that the whole of the Island is part of the ROC when in reality this is not the case and was recognised to be the case when the acquis was suspended in the North as the ROC did not and still does not have effective control over that area. The Orams have not complied with the laws of the ROC, it is true. They have however fully complied with the laws of the government of the TRNC who DO have control in the relevant area. It all boils down to non recognition of the TRNC, however, if there is an elephant in your kitchen it is no good closing your eyes and continually saying it does not exist. The TRNC has existed for years and will not go away!

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 18:16

twaddle wrote: "They have however fully complied with the laws of the government of the TRNC who DO have control in the relevant area."



Sadly for the Orams and others in their position, that is meaningless in international law.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 18:31

Dear Twaddle



re 13



You have the problem spot on..



But you have to accept that the decision to claim" "independence" was the folly..if you can't do that - then you will be banging your head against the wall :(



YES, the ECJ base their decision based on the current FACT that the RoC *is* "de jure" the govt. of all of Cyprus ..



>>laws of "TRNC"<< The official line is that "TRNC" is a vessel of TR and TR are NOT the legal govt. of Cyprus.. there is no getting away from that. That is another problem.



Now if there hadn't been a TC YES to ANNAN, I'd have said "that was that".. the TCs are keeping themselves in a bind by persisting "TRNC" must be recognised.. it just isn't going to happen while China / Russia are on side with the RoC



YES there is an "elephant in the kitchen", .. and no one important will "recognise it - nor can / will they - without a deal for all of Cyprus ...

twaddle


Joined: 06/07/2008
Posts: 245

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 19:10

So in the mean time, we all risk losing a lot of money because of an unsafe and unsatisfactory judgement. I know what the international position is. It is just so very very wrong that the TRNC is treated as a pariah state and yet the real pariahs such as Iran, Syria, Sudan etc etc are allowed international recognition, free trade and direct flights, where does justice come into that?.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 19:27

Dear Twaddle



re msg 17



The Judgement is legally correct.. "TRNC" isn't treated like a "pariah state" - it ISN'T a state..

twaddle


Joined: 06/07/2008
Posts: 245

Message Posted:
25/06/2009 19:41

Mark, the judgement is legally correct in so much as it complies with what the ECJ consider to be the best interests of the EU membership. However I maintain that it is unsafe as there appears to be a conflict of interests with at least one of the panel of judges. With regard to whether the TRNC is a state, then yes, I accept what you say in terms of International law. However, the International law did not seem to have any impact upon the state sponsored terrorism against TCs in the 1960s when it chose to turn a blind eye. Perhaps it should turn a blind eye as it does with Taiwan which is also not a state but has very good International links and business contacts.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
26/06/2009 13:38

Dear Twaddle



there is no UN security Council Resolution calling for Taiwan to be "legally invalid" China knows it would not go through....



The Judges were a panel so even IF there was a any bias ...



Lastly - the Advocate General has already given her advice.. the decision was as expected.



As you know Turkey is a member and has judges sitting on the ECHR panel in property cases brought by GCs against Turkey!



Which Judgements should we now consider "unsafe" if we are to use your criteria?

twaddle


Joined: 06/07/2008
Posts: 245

Message Posted:
26/06/2009 14:00

Fair point.





You know, no one likes a smart arse!!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
26/06/2009 14:02

re 21



Luckily my wife does, and I like hers ;)