an obscure question concerning Hitler

daisy dukes


Joined: 06/09/2008
Posts: 3815

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 19:28

I was once told that Hitler was a grandmaster of chess....does anyone know if this is true?





DD

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 20:07

Sounds more like sarcasm here DD than an obscure question!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

satranc


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 92

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 20:10

Don't think so DD. He would have had to play in many competitions over many years against Russians and other international players and I think he was a bit busy with other things. I've certainly never seen any of his games published although he could well have been a strong player. A World of difference though from being a GrandMaster. 1.e4

daisy dukes


Joined: 06/09/2008
Posts: 3815

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 20:19

Do you really have to compete to be a competitor...?





DD

TheSaints



Joined: 28/01/2009
Posts: 1369

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 20:24

Do you really have to antagonise to be antagonistic...?

Mr Vince


Joined: 24/07/2008
Posts: 696

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 21:06

Do you realy have to cycle at the side of the road to be psychopath

Mindy



Joined: 27/10/2008
Posts: 1210

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 21:59

Doesn't deserve an answer.....

minertor



Joined: 14/02/2009
Posts: 1238

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 23:40

Hitler was maybe one of the greatest leaders the world has ever seen. If he'd stuck to building cars and motorways then history might have shown him in a better light. Unfortunately, he listened to some bad advisers. If you look at 1920's Germany and how Hitler transformed it, until the late 30's when his plans outstripped his capabilities, some might say that we backed the wrong horse. Look what happened, USSR.

Was it worth it?



Tony

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
15/12/2009 23:53

He started beleiving his own propaganda---- that always leads to disaster

Baspinar Bob


Joined: 15/02/2008
Posts: 618

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 08:05

daisy dukes

I think history will tell you that Churchill was a better player, metephoricaly speaking.



Bob.

DutchCrusader



Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 11281

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 09:23

RE msg 8, minertor: (...) Hitler was maybe one of the greatest leaders the world has ever seen. (...)

=> I agree! He was also one of the greatest military leaders the world has ever seen... He only lost the war because his generals betrayed him... And he always kept his word... In "Mein Kampf" (Google: "My struggle", available on line, in English) he announced his plans for the future... Including immoral wars against his neigbours ("Lebensraum") and (to begin with) the destruction of the Jews in Europe, the Gypsies, the weak and others "not worthy to live in the Third Reich"... And he built highways - to speed up the movements of his armies...

To keep it short: I don't believe you were serious when you wrote your message about maybe the greatest criminal the world has ever seen, Tony (minertor).

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 09:28

I'm sure I saw him playing chess at Guidos ?

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 09:41

Msg 12 , not funny

DutchCrusader



Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 11281

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 09:42

In this thread: some of the finest examples of the famous British sense of humour.

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 10:08

Yeh , you got that right Hans !

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 10:23

DC,



"He only lost the war because his generals betrayed him..."

He only lost the war beacause his Generals couldn't kill him, you mean.

There was supposed to have existed a plot or plots, by the Allies, to assassinate Hitler, which was called-off when it was realised that whoever would take over from him wouldn't make as an almighty hash of it as Hitler was going to. If the Generals had got their way, history could have been very different.

I am also quite surprised at your implied "admiration" (as a Dutchman) of Hitler. Still, it takes all kinds.

DutchCrusader



Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 11281

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 10:33

RE msg 16: Sarcasm. And ""He only lost the war because his generals betrayed him..." is a quote from the diaries of Joseph Goebbels, Hitler's Minister of Propaganda. I didn't realise you didn't know that.

minertor



Joined: 14/02/2009
Posts: 1238

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 11:22

msg 10: history will always be recorded by the winners of wars. In uk, my best friend is a German contemporary of mine. We never discuss the war, it's history. One day he was trying to wind me up over soccer, pointing out German victories. I said that '18, '45 and '66 were three good years for us. He said, rather heatedly, that if that stupid paperhanger hadn't attacked Russia and Japan had kept USA out of it, the war would have been over in'42, with Germany victorious. He then said that the first person hung as a war criminal "would have been that bledy Churchill", followed by "Bomber Harris". He claimed that they were responsible for the bombings of all cities, British and German. I thought it better to continue with our golf, I always beat him at that.

This guy was a hotelier in Reeth, in the Yorkshire Dales, just about the most popular person in town.

There is always another perspective if one bothers to look, not thqat I agree with him, but I did "bother to look" Respect

Tony

Aussie


Joined: 17/06/2007
Posts: 657

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 12:19

Whilst the evil of Hitler and the Nazi regime is not in dispute there is a tendency to blame Hitler for all of Germany's Military defeats later in the war without crediting him for the earlier successes.



Hitler was very successful in exploiting the weaknesses of the western allies before WW2 obtaining many concessions and running great risks that most of the army and advisers argued against in the remiliterisation of the Rhine land and seizing Austria and Czechoslovakia.



He also approved the very innovative and bold offensive which destroyed France and despite the in fatal decision to invade Russia was also effective in preventing the complete destruction of the German army in Russia in the winter of 1941 with his stand fast orders. The alternative strategic retreat supported by most generals would have been virtually impossible in the conditions without destroying the integrity of the army such as happened with Napoleon before.

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 12:27

DC

msg 17

It's actually irony rather than sarcasm, but I'm glad to hear it.

Aussie


Joined: 17/06/2007
Posts: 657

Message Posted:
16/12/2009 12:28

The final great German offensive on the Eastern front at Kursk (operation Citidal) was very much a plan of the generals that Hitler had grave misgiving about and this the largest tank battle in history finally destroyed the last realistic chance of a German victory in the East.



Unfortunately for Hitler and the Third Reich and fortunately for the Allies Hitler drew too much confidence from these earlier correct decisions and developed a deep mistrust for most of his generals.



He then became increasing unrealistic later in the war ordering the holding of many untenable positions and issued impossible orders in the end accelerated the destruction for Germany.



I believe at the end of the war most of the major surviving generals and political figures tended to blame all of Germany's failures on Hitler and downplay their own roles as well.



Aussie

phylray



Joined: 21/09/2007
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
17/12/2009 11:47

Only someone who is too young to remember, too lazy to read the history, and didn't

live in a country occupied by Nazi forces during WW2 could talk such nonsense, (unless

it's a weird sense of humour) He did have a brilliant general in Rommel though, but was

beaten by Montgomery and our desert rats at a horrific cost to all. Nobody really wins in war.

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
17/12/2009 15:40

The Dutch, per capita, were the largest collaborators during WW2!



Richard

DutchCrusader



Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 11281

Message Posted:
17/12/2009 19:39

RE msg 23, Brinsley: (...) The Dutch, per capita, were the largest collaborators during WW2! (...)

=> Not the first time you mention this fact and again it has nothing to do with the tread nor any of the posts here. What is your point? Blame me for it?.

P.S. Same rubbish: how many Maori's did you kill today?

LOvegod


Joined: 22/03/2009
Posts: 161

Message Posted:
17/12/2009 20:09

Had Hitler died of a heart attack in say july 1938 he would have gone down in history as one of the greatest leaders of all time. The british and other press were full of praise for him at that period in history. The german nation was almost totally destroyed at the end of the great war. Their weimar republic was full of bent politicians , abit like ours now. This one man restored the nation before going off the rails in 1939.

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
17/12/2009 20:22

aussie message 19,



it is remarkable that prior to the attack on poland 1 september 1939,

hitler was more or less given what he wanted by the european powers:



the 1934 re-occupation of saarland

the 1934 plan to illegaly rebuild germany's armed forces

the 1935 anglo-german naval agreement

the 1936 berlin olympics

the 1936 military occupation of the rhineland

the 1936 german/italian intervention in spain

the 1938 occupation of austria

the 1938 munich agreement effectively handing germany the sudtenland

the 1939 occupation of bohemia-moravia and takeover of memel

the 1939 molotov-ribbentrop friendship pact secretly dividing up poland



so the biggest collaborators with hitler at least up to ww2 were:

britain, france and russia!

daisy dukes


Joined: 06/09/2008
Posts: 3815

Message Posted:
17/12/2009 20:27

erm....so does anyone know if he was the great chessmaster that i was told...not to go off topic or anything....





DD

TheSaints



Joined: 28/01/2009
Posts: 1369

Message Posted:
18/12/2009 00:23

Does one have to stare to be a Stirrer?

newscoop


Joined: 23/12/2007
Posts: 2197

Message Posted:
18/12/2009 00:29

There is a photo of him playing chess with Lenin.



There is a suspicion that it may not be kosher.

DutchCrusader



Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 11281

Message Posted:
18/12/2009 00:38

Amazing in this thread - the words in praise and/or admiration of the biggest criminal in 2000 years, Hitler (Adi Schicklgruber). I'm very glad Mr. Churchill and your parents thought different in 1939.

TheSaints



Joined: 28/01/2009
Posts: 1369

Message Posted:
18/12/2009 01:03

You will get no praise or admiration for him from this quarter..............