putting property in trust

teacher3


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 5

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 10:34

Our solicitor has offered to put our property in trust- for a £500 fee and £100 per year admin (we don't have deeds yet and the complex is not completed). What are the likely pitfalls?



Teacher 3

PeeCee


Joined: 16/03/2009
Posts: 133

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 10:55

Sorry, but I'm still confused over this despite reading mountains of stuff. I thought that the issue with the Orams case was one of Trespass NOT necessarily property ownership as such. You could still be sued for trespass but might not have to remove you house - but you would still have to get out of it. It's a mess all round

Harold2555



Joined: 19/04/2008
Posts: 1139

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 10:55

If you are talking about your cypriot property I can't see the advantages. Certainly in terms of protection from an Orams type case.



I stand to be corrected though





Harold

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 11:08

I agree with PeeCee. It's not about ownership - it's about trespass.

Molly


Joined: 30/08/2008
Posts: 299

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 11:17

Message 2



You are correct. Whether the title deed is in your name or not is immaterial; you can be taken to court for having possession of the property. We all know that the Orams did not deny Mr A the use of his land, the TRNC did in the first instance and will continue to do so.



Putting the title deed in trust does not give you 100% security either; it also significantly increases your tax liability. We are all waiting for the government to give guidance (which may be a long time coming) but you should look into it in far greater detail. The TRNC have created this situation and must find a remedy that involves no additional cost to purchasers who acted under their laws. There will always be law firms who identify new areas of opportunity but do not proceed without knowing what all the pros and cons are.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 14:10

teacher3

"what are the likely pitfalls".

Depends on who and what constitutes the trust. Would suggest you read the tags 'lawyers' and' solicitors' before you decide.



I would be a bit concerned as to why your lawyer suggests a trust will make a difference . Be wary.



Under TRNC law you own your villa and at the same time under UK law you cant use it.



There will be a lot of sharks out there looking to take financial advantage by increasing a false perception of a threat, and when people buy into that threat. then produce a false remedy.

PeeCee


Joined: 16/03/2009
Posts: 133

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 14:45

Maybe there's a moral to this. As someone on a post said - "beware Greeks bringing gifts". We should also be concerned about Lawyers bringing solutions at a price!

Pipie


Joined: 05/01/2008
Posts: 5499

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 14:48

After all of the negative experiences regarding solicitors I would think more than twice and still say no to this !!!

BillBarnacle


Joined: 20/04/2009
Posts: 167

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 15:44

" SAVE YOUR MONEY "



Putting your property into a trust affords you NO protection from RoC action



It is all about trespass and not ownership

TheSaints



Joined: 28/01/2009
Posts: 1369

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 15:48

agree with msg 9



If you have no PTP or Kocan and your property is not even completed yet, you are not residing in it you have no risk (Except from your bulder and advocate) why waste your money.

jay76


Joined: 17/07/2008
Posts: 532

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 15:49

Who ever the solicitors i would say to them if the trust is so secure then to set up a deal that if i lose my house then i can have your house in turkey when and if the day comes, bet they say no

Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 19:40

Shouldn't it be putting your home in England in Trust so that it cannot be used as part of your assets?

Makes no difference to your property in the TRNC as no one can get to your assets in the TRNC.



Yet another idea to increase the advocates wallet whilst giving you no protection at all.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 19:44

I agree with Bradus. If you have concerns, put your UK property in trust. Speak to a Solicitor who specialises in trusts. The Law Society will be able to advise you.

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 20:42

"if your property is not even completed yet, you are not residing in it you have no risk"

Sorry to disappoint you but if the GC can prove you instructed a builder to "damage" (build on) the property then that would also count as trespass.



A UK trust might work but a Cyprus one won't. Write out trespass a 100 times. Each year there are 1 million cases of individuals trespassing in north Cyprus.

TheSaints



Joined: 28/01/2009
Posts: 1369

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 20:47

Reading the first post it states they are buying on a complex which I took to mean that the plans were already inplace not they were planning and advising a builder to build for them just buying off plan.



Don't think I will do the lines.....

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 20:59

Thanks to the Orams case I learnt how to spell trespass!

If the contract does not contain any instruction involving building it'll be simple trespass but still without the option to return. But all this first still has to go to GC courts in the south, I believe.

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 21:25

Ownership is not contestable unless you are able to challenge an ROC title. Some ROC titles may well be contestable. Certainly all land on Cyprus was not registered pre 1974.



To put TRNC property in trust for the fees mentioned is qute frankly a rip off. Do not do it, TRNC law would have no creedence in any litigation.

UK assets are better moved to trust or passed over to other family members.

Tresspass litigation is a risk but the trewards to the applicant are not particularly attractive.

Most GC's would get far better return in applying to the IPC.

It all comes down to the type of GC that has or held the ROC title. If he is a politically motivated character like Mr. Appostolides then lookout. If he only seeks money then he will apply to the IPC or ECHR who may indeed refer him to IPC anyway.

The next few months will see which way the GC population will manouvre.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
02/02/2010 23:42

I have heard of another advocate who does not answer his emails and when he does never gives answers to your questions. Yet - the day after the Orams case he contacted his clients and offered to put ALL THEIR ASSETS into a trust fund controlled by his company. For this they only had to pay him £1500 (I think) and £100 per year

Wasn't this kind of this advocate to go to all this bother for his clients????????????????????????????????

scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
Posts: 1070

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 03:21

Forget about your property in the TRNC.

You have to worry about your UK. property. That's what they will come after.

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 10:20

As Molly has pointed out - and this is vital - thoroughly check out the tax liability before committing your property to any advocate's 'Trust' - the tax implications are horrendous, to say the least!



'Do not proceed until you know what all the 'pros' and 'cons' are,' Molly advises.



That should have been: 'Beware of a 'con' by a 'pro'!'

teacher3


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 5

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 21:33

Thanks for all the comments - I think that we've been put off the idea and will see if anything comes from the peace talks.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 22:19

Teacher - don't hold your breath on the talks.

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 22:31

Any trust formed or administered in the TRNC will offer no protection whatsoever in any EU Court.

It appears that some advoctes in TRNC are offering a service.

Dont waste your money!!

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 23:11

if you have property in the uk ,then the chances are you own the property or properties jointly with your wife /husband, when and if you purchace a property in the kktc ,then only buy in one name ,this way they

cannot touch your assets in the uk as one or the other has no involvement in cyprus ,so no action can be taken.

rest assured there will be more loop holes ,there always is.



musin



long live the KKTC

westender


Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 328

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 23:20

It wouldn't matter whose name the UK or Cyprus property is in as you would be sued for trespass and I assume that generally a husband and wife would go on holiday together.

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
03/02/2010 23:58

Be extremely careful about putting UK property into trust. There are yearly tax liability implications for a start. Plus who are the Trustees? Who is the property in trust for? If it's yourselves then it's not really a bona fide trust is it?