Appliances and laptop dead after electric came back

ataturk


Joined: 09/09/2008
Posts: 712

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 21:24

With the recent power cuts recently we had a host of problems with appliances and laptops when the electric came back on. Our fridge went, the boys macbook charger went, the router power supply went, the wife's laptop doesn't charge anymore and the aircon went.



I managed to get it sorted through the insurance but I am sure they wont be too happy to pay up next time. I thought about getting a large surge protector for the whole house but my insurance guy said I needed a device Voltage regulator and said that it would cost about £2000 (ouch). Whats the difference between the two and who would supply these items here.

catalkoykid


Joined: 15/02/2009
Posts: 1190

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 21:29

elko is your man a fraction of the price

catalkoykid


Joined: 15/02/2009
Posts: 1190

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 21:33

ismetus@gmail.com

Homepage http://www.elkocyprus.com

Member Space

Mobile: 0533 862 9150



Name ismet



hes the fella

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 21:47

The only man worth talking to Ismet email him from his web site http://elkocyprus.com/e-index.html tel - 009 0392 366 6048

I am sure that you will have the best price.



Tom

dataman


Joined: 14/06/2010
Posts: 61

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 22:41

You do need a voltage regulator to protect your appliances.



I'll tell you exactly what has happened. The Electric boys have lost the neutral condutor either through a 3rd party fault or their own incompetence. This would not happen in the UK as the Neutral is always bonded to the distribution earth. In this way it stops the voltage rising above 240 V on a 3 phase sytem when th neutral is disconnected for any reason.



I'm sure you can get a cheap electronic voltage sensor that could be connected to a shunt trip for less than £150.



All the best - Rob Bsc (Hons) Eng

Smity



Joined: 14/09/2009
Posts: 826

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 22:50

I agree with dataman get a voltage regulator

Smity



Joined: 14/09/2009
Posts: 826

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 23:16

I have just checked on the RS web site avoltage stabiliser to give protection up to 75amps will cost £ 1070 +VAT

LostFound


Joined: 03/08/2009
Posts: 387

Message Posted:
24/06/2010 23:20

Is that the same thing as a Surge Protector which I have plugged in to my TV and Computer which is cheap to purchase.

ataturk


Joined: 09/09/2008
Posts: 712

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 00:30

As it happens some of the items were plugged into belkin surge protectors and they still got spiked and they are supposed to be guranteed

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 01:01

Mike - Check on Ismet's site http://www.elkocyprus.com --- as mentioned before he has Domestic uits up to 30 KVA and industrial ones up to 180 KVA as well as some "power killers" check his prices (you will have to call him) I suspect they will leave RS looking very overpriced.

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 07:32

Lostfound,



The short answer (pardon the pun) is no... The type of four/eight gang socket surge protectors only guard against surges and spikes and do not protect your equipment from high or low voltages that may occur in quite an even way.



You could employ an Uninterruptable Power Supply (UPS) which will clean the power and provide time to shut down in an organised way when the power goes off.



The best answer is a combination of both a voltage regulator and UPS. A Voltage regulator for the whole house will cost about £2,000 and will protect everything from all the various electrical power supply problems apart from a power cut... which is where the UPS comes in.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 09:18

I have just noticed this thread. If you had invested just 100 TL and bought one of my Elko voltage Protectors, it would have saved you all the cost. Available in Girne from Tektan and Octopus Pools.

Just a few points:

1. A Voltage Regulator will adjust your voltage and have a steady output of say 220 volts. My voltage regulators will cut off supply if it goes outside safety limits. ELKO 20 KVA Regulator (sufficient for a house) costs 1100 and 1300 dollars depending on type.



2. Elko voltage Protector is a very small device which can be plugged into any socket. If ther voltage goes outside set safety limits, it will trip the mains and protect the whole house.



3. A surge protector (like Belgins) protects against very high surges like lightening etc. A surge protector is not an alternative to 1 or 2 above, neither 1 or 2 above does the job of a surge protector.

ismet

rigsby


Joined: 21/09/2007
Posts: 912

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 10:44

Good advice as usual, Ismet

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 12:49

msg. 5

Dataman,

Your analysis about a disconnected neutral wire or sometimes bad connection is valid. In UK the neutral is earthed every third pole but in Cyprus it is earthed only at the 11000/415V step down transformer. However if you live in a block of apartment, the Elko voltage protector is still essential. the apartment block is supplied with 3 phase electricity and each flat is connected to a single phase and evenly divided up between the phases as far as possible. Now suppose the neutral going into the apartment block is severed or has a bad connection. The neutral wire inside the block will be floating and hence some flats may get 350+ voltages which is fatal for all equipment.

So I advise everybody at least to buy the Elko Voltage protector. The idea of tripping the RCD (residual Current Device) came from my son and I did the design and the manufacturing side. All my family are using one including my mother in law

ismet

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 13:12

Msg 10 - Elko regulators from about £745 as I said a little cheaper! Plus you will get Ismet's advice and knowledged worth more than the difference that you are not paying.

Voltage protectors "power killer" only 100 TL roughly £45. I intend to get one when next over (its cheaper than a couple of transformers/power supplies).

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 16:27

Oh, just one more point that I overlooked. If you have a three phase backup generator at home or work, then I say that Elko Voltage Protecror is a must. Unfortuantely Kib-tek insist that the changeover contactor for the mains-generator switch should switch over the three phases and the neutral. So if the neutral leg of the contactor does not press on properly than you have the same danger as a missing neutral i.e voltages of 300 plus. It happened at two places that I know of, one in Famagusta workplace and the other one in Lapta in a large residence.

ismet

LostFound


Joined: 03/08/2009
Posts: 387

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 16:59

Elko 2



If I purchase a voltage protector does it work on my generator (I dont have electric) my geni is a 7.5? Im not a technical person so I dont understand message 16!

keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 18:30

Ismet,

Is there anything to stop you securely Grounding the Neutrals on both sides of the Contactor, and simply 'not telling them'?

loulou



Joined: 14/05/2008
Posts: 785

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 18:39

elko is your man we got one several months ago 100tl brill

Ozbey


Joined: 04/03/2009
Posts: 304

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 19:24

Elko,



I'm very interested to read that your mother-in-law is fitted with a voltage protector.

If she experiences a power surge, will it trip her off too?

This could be a big selling point.



Thanks for the good advice, as always.

Kind regards,

Ozbey

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
25/06/2010 23:06

msg. 17

Lostfound,

Let me try to keep it simple for you. So you rely on your genny for electrics all the time. Normally you shoud have a device (called RCD, Residual Current Device) near your main switch or on your distribution board. This device is to protect you against any earth faults. If you have any current flowing to earth this RCD should cut off your electricity. It has a small test button on it which should cut off your electricity when pressed.

If you do have an RCD, then you can use the Elko Voltage Protector and in case of danger it will trip off your RCD. Otherwise it will not protect you but it will simply tell you what your voltage is and you take note accordingly if something is abnormal. I hope this helps:

ismet

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
26/06/2010 00:52

msg 18

Keith;

Yes you can earth the neutral, not sure about the regulations but I cannot see why not. However if you do have an RCD before the earth connection of the neutral, the RCD will keep tripping because there is always a small voltage on the neutral which will carry enough current to earth to trip the RCD. Even if you have 0.5 volts on the neutral and your earth connection is less than one ohm, the earth current will be over 500 ma, enough to trip the RCD.

ismet

phylray



Joined: 21/09/2007
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
26/06/2010 01:41

My fridge has broken down twice in last 6 months and latest it cost over £100 to fix.

I am afraid it may be the cuts that do it, but not everyone's do the same.

I was told there was a plug I could get back home from Argos which was quite cheap.

Can't remember the name of it.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
26/06/2010 09:08

msg. 23

Phylray,

The plug you are talking about must be a "Surge Protector" or a "Surge Arrester", same thing, see msg. 12 above. Tektan used to sell these and I hope they have some in stock.



The main problem is our voltage which is nominally at 240 volts whereas most of Europe is 220 volts. Now most fridgers etc. imported from Turkey have the 230 volts label on them but I suspect they are truly 220 volts. To make things worse at some places our voltage goes even above 255 volts and hence the problem. Your only true option is to get a voltage regulator with a safety cut off function like my Elko brand, otherwise it may be "out of the frying pan into the fire" situation if anything goes wrong with the regulator.

ismet

keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
26/06/2010 11:21

Thanks for that Ismet,

My Genny and automatic start / changeover box are outside, and then the feed comes to the house, so that the RCD is 'downstream' of the contactor etc.

I'll be driving some nice Earth rods into the ground very shortly!