Freedom of expression in North Cyprus

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 08:34

Dear friends,

The chilling intimidation campaign against WikiLeaks (when they have broken no laws) is an attack on freedom of the press and democracy. We urgently need a massive public outcry to stop the crackdown -- let's get to 1 million voices and take out full page ads in US newspapers this week!



The massive campaign of intimidation against WikiLeaks is sending a chill through free press advocates everywhere.



Legal experts say WikiLeaks has likely broken no laws. Yet top US politicians have called it a terrorist group and commentators have urged assassination of its staff. The organization has come under massive government and corporate attack, but WikiLeaks is only publishing information provided by a whistleblower. And it has partnered with the world's leading newspapers (NYT, Guardian, Spiegel etc) to carefully vet the information it publishes.



The massive extra-judicial intimidation of WikiLeaks is an attack on democracy. We urgently need a public outcry for... Cont'd

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 08:36

Cont'd...

We urgently need a public outcry for freedom of the press and expression. Sign the petition to stop the crackdown and forward this email to everyone -- let's get to 1 million voices and take out full page ads in US newspapers this week!



http://www.avaaz.org/en/wikileaks_petition/?vl



WikiLeaks isn't acting alone -- it's partnered with the top newspapers in the world (New York Times, The Guardian, Der Spiegel, etc) to carefully review 250,000 US diplomatic cables and remove any information that it is irresponsible to publish. Only 800 cables have been published so far.

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 08:38

Cont'd....



Past WikiLeaks publications have exposed government-backed torture, the murder of innocent civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan, and corporate corruption.



The US government is currently pursuing all legal avenues to stop WikiLeaks from publishing more cables, but the laws of democracies protect freedom of the press. The US and other governments may not like the laws that protect our freedom of expression, but that's exactly why it's so important that we have them, and why only a democratic process can change them.

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 08:40

Cont'd...



Reasonable people can disagree on whether WikiLeaks and the leading newspapers it's partnered with are releasing more information than the public should see. Whether the releases undermine diplomatic confidentiality and whether that's a good thing. Whether WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange has the personal character of a hero or a villain. But none of this justifies a vicious campaign of intimidation to silence a legal media outlet by governments and corporations. Click below to join the call to stop the crackdown:



http://www.avaaz.org/en/wikileaks_petition/?vl



Ever wonder why the media so rarely gives the full story of what happens behind the scenes? This is why - because when they do, governments can be vicious in their response. And when that happens, it's up to the public to stand up for our democratic rights to a free press and freedom of expression. Never has there been a more vital time for us to do so.

deputydawg


Joined: 30/03/2010
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 09:20

Tenakoutou. I sincerely wish you well with this but wonder if you will now be noted somewhere secretly as a subversive. I am so cynical about the modern world that I believe the media are as corrupt as governments. They are the first to get in bed with political parties for illlegal financial favours when elections come around. Your post coincides with media reports that world wide corruption is now rife and icreasing. I think we all realise that without the media telling us.

doggiesteve


Joined: 06/10/2010
Posts: 265

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 09:28

as visitors to trnc we have no rights not even human rights under international law .



only citizens have rights under trnc constitution !

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 19:00

doggiesteve: and what you have posted should also be featured as a warning on the Foreign & Commonwealth Office [FCO] website.

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 19:17

deputydawg wrote, "wonder if you will now be noted somewhere secretly as a subversive"

But then that would be leaked so it wouldn't be secret anymore

walkerscott


Joined: 13/08/2009
Posts: 901

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 19:26

Well done Wikileaks - after the expenses scandals we now see how out representatives really represent us!

Transparency in most parts of Government is a good thing! I've already voted in support of WikiLeaks.

deputydawg


Joined: 30/03/2010
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 19:36

Malsancak. More power to leaks but that does not expunge names from lists does it !

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 19:49

deputydawg, it would just be a list then - me and 6 million others

apc2010


Joined: 28/07/2010
Posts: 1689

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 19:51

Freedom of expression in North Cyprus.............



is this a dig at the recently closed thread ..........???

CJtill


Joined: 02/05/2008
Posts: 836

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 20:14

All well and good for democracy etc etc, but like everything in life, its not black and white. There should\must be secrets, and sensitive information should be suppressed for the overall good of the people.

We can well do without these do gooders whose main intention seems to reignite the flames of conflict.

Count me out.

Michael

apc2010


Joined: 28/07/2010
Posts: 1689

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 20:19

micheal ..........why secrets ,they are voted in by the public(governments) ......overall good of who............????????????

deputydawg


Joined: 30/03/2010
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 20:58

Only 6 million. Not enough to change anything then.

ozkent


Joined: 08/05/2010
Posts: 111

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 21:44

how much did wikileak charge the guardian and other newspapers they don't do howt for nowt.

did you see there offices inthe mail not some back street place.

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
09/12/2010 23:28

how else would we know what goes on, dont you want to know what they get up to behind closed doors. How the rich get richer by a war somewhere. All credit to him and I hope fredom of speech prevails. Ozkent those offices were there before wiki . xx

zookeeper


Joined: 17/03/2010
Posts: 168

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 05:27

I am not sending out my usual Christmas cards and Christmas letters this year. I am just sending one to the American Ambassador. It will be all round the world in a few days.

ozkent


Joined: 08/05/2010
Posts: 111

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 07:15

I have no problem with the idea of wikileak i just question the fact that the richest newspapers get the

jusiet bit of leak. Also that this guy assange is swaning round the world on an ego trip. Also that all the leaks are aimed at the yanks , a chineas plot ?. I have read some of the leaks i;e the ones about Turkey and found them very interesting.

itfc1978


Joined: 31/03/2009
Posts: 187

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 08:58

Everyone has secrets, you have, I have, corporations have, goverments have, countries have and for a good reason to protect yourself,your assets, your people.

Of course it`s abused but that`s human nature.

It does not mean having secrets is wrong

Most of the leaks seem to be nothing more then low level tittle tattle designed for Hello mag readers.



But consider the for one moment, the leaks of important secret installations, that does put lifes at risk and it could be yours if you live near one.



Does not get my support

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 09:08

So, itfc1978, if there's an impending Chernobyl-type disaster, say in Iran, do you think this info. should be suppressed?

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 09:11

deputydawg, 6 million voters can change a lot if they have EU votes.

Governments do NOT believe in secrets unless they are their own. The pro-secret posters here only believe in keeping secret their own governments' secrets. I wonder how many would be happy to discover how much of their personal information that they would like kept secret is readily available to their government should they wish to collect it. It is not until you're on the wrong side of a government that you realise how powerless you are.

itfc1978


Joined: 31/03/2009
Posts: 187

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 09:19

matters not a jot if it`s surpressed or not it will happen anyway and picked up very quickly by the rest of the world



So Tenakoutou you think it`s ok to release the locations of important installations?

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 10:12

itfc1978/Msg 23:



If it threatens one's own populace, it should be exposed; rather like the case[s] in UK, where the suppression of information re. the health hazards of waste incineration plants [some operating illegally] has, or could, seriously affect the health of the inhabitants in the surrounding area.



You are viewing the whole situation from too narrow a perspective - i.e., 'blinkered'!



There's 2 'p's in 'suppressed' - not an 'r' - but, you may have the benefit of the doubt that you simply 'hit' the wrong key!

deputydawg


Joined: 30/03/2010
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 10:54

Always bear in mind that when there are leaks of classified information oft times it is addressed by deliberately leaking disinformation. What was alledgedly said by one party to or about another can be fabricated by third parties for gain so that the truth in every situation becomes very elusive.

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 11:12

itfc1978 wrote "So Tenakoutou you think it`s ok to release the locations of important installations? "

Google StreetView showed the SAS HQ in Hereford and the government made them blank it out for security reasons despite people everyday walking past and seeing exactly the same view.

On a more personal note, in the 1960s you were not allowed to know that rivers were being polluted because the Acid & Alkali Inspectorate said that this was secret information. I was in charge of the Water Standards Laboratory of an enormous Chemical Factory at the time and knew what pollutants were pouring into the water but couldn't tell anyone without risking imprisonment or a large fine. Some of this water was being recycled for mains water.

CJtill


Joined: 02/05/2008
Posts: 836

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 11:55

Talk about own goals (and I am not talking about Ipswich Town Football Club here), as I bet some chap called Al is sitting around some high tech cave just outside Kabul, rubbing his hands with glee, as the dolts in the west are presenting him with even more points of vulnerability, all in the cause of democracy.

Oh what fools we are.

Michael

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 12:26

CJtill, perhaps we should blame the person who set about discovering the points of vulnerability and then storing this information so insecurely that it was allegedly leaked by private Bradley Manning - http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/86525/20101129/us-wikileaks-bradley-manning-factfile-who-is.htm .

If a private is able to give away secret information, who else could have sold this information to terrorists? If anything it shows the dangers of collecting information which could be a danger in the wrong hands.

pollymarples


Joined: 08/08/2010
Posts: 1778

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 12:30

You will all end up in custody with Malc. the Mastic and Laura the laptop.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 15:12

What a totally misleading title to this thread



Wikileaks is not discriminate in what it publishes. For this reason, the Guardian decided not to print the data on what is termed 'vulnerable US strategic sites'.

There needs to be greater transparency, so I do agree with the general principle of Wikileaks and many of it's acts , however, as Assange is prepared to toss anything in to the general domain, I am inclined to think he is more an anarchist than a responsible libertarian.

Middle Easter


Joined: 13/06/2007
Posts: 146

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 16:19

All.



Come on everyone. We cannot have every discussion & correspondence debated by government in the public domain. That's why we vote for them to lead our countries & formulate policy on the 'big issues'



Wikileaks is nothing more than cheap political voyeurism. It is right & proper to have private discussion behind closed doors, which contributes to formulating owverall strategy.



If we pick the bones out of everything that everyone has said at govermental level, it will be the end of challenging debate as we know it.....







































.

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 16:34

Middle Easter, perhaps you should be more specific about which leaks you feel the public should not know about and then we could discuss them. I find that governments prefer to control what we know in order to manipulate us and to gain political advantages which boost their own power. Here is an example leak:

"WikiLeaks has released a classified US military video depicting the indiscriminate slaying of over a dozen people in the Iraqi suburb of New Baghdad -- including two Reuters news staff. Reuters has been trying to obtain the video through the Freedom of Information Act, without success since the time of the attack. The video, shot from an Apache helicopter gun-sight, clearly shows the unprovoked slaying of a wounded Reuters employee and his rescuers. Two young children involved in the rescue were also seriously wounded. "

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 17:25

Assange's Interpol Warrant Is for Having Sex Without a Condom



When Interpol issued an arrest warrant earlier this week for WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange, the international police agency charged him with "sex crimes" but didn't specify the offense any further, prompting rumors that he had been accused of rape. He hadn't. "It turns out," Washington's Blog reports, that "it was for violating an obscure Swedish law against having sex without a condom." During a business trip to Stockholm last August, Assange had unprotected sex with two women (a bizarre and painfully detailed account is available on the Daily Mail's Web site) who upon realizing that they had both slept with him—and that he had blown them both off—jointly approached police about his refusal to take an STD test. At the time, Assange's Swedish lawyer confirmed that "the principal concern the women had about Assange's behavior …

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 17:27

cont...

related to his lack of interest in using condoms and his refusal to undergo testing, at the women's request, for sexually transmitted disease." (Assange actually did use a condom with one of the women, but it broke.) This, apparently, is hazy legal territory in Sweden. While the "consent of both women to sex with Assange has been confirmed by prosecutors," as a former attorney wrote in an impassioned op-ed, Assange has been charged with something called "sex by surprise," which reportedly carries a $715 fine. According to Assange's London attorney, Mark Stephens, prosecutors have yet to explain the charges or meet with the WikiLeaks chief to discuss them, which he's agreed to do. "Whatever 'sex by surprise' is, it's only an offense in Sweden—not in the U.K. or the U.S. or even Ibiza," Stephens fumed. "I feel as if I'm in a surreal Swedish movie being threatened by bizarre trolls."



Slatest Edition

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 18:06

apparently, to be legally safe, in Sweden each time before having sex it's best to have signed consent from your husband or wife.

LordJim


Joined: 12/10/2010
Posts: 221

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 18:10

test the condom before you use it as well.

Pugwash


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 1797

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 18:14

They are going to do him over real bad, i wouldn't like to be him now.

walkerscott


Joined: 13/08/2009
Posts: 901

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 19:18

Incredible - nearly 400,000 signatures in one day for press freedom!



http://www.avaaz.org/en/wikileaks_petition/?cl=854090326&v=7738

swannee7


Joined: 21/08/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 19:36

There's been a lot of good debate on the pros & cons of this issue in this thread. Made for interesting reading. BUT there does seem to be something more sinister afoot, perpetrated by the Wikileaks underground supporters, and that is they've hacked into the mainframe computers of large corporations - specifically used by Joe Public - and caused their databases to go haywire. Corporations such as major credit card companies, Amazon, PayPal etc.etc. This is clear-cut sabotage based on revenge (as those companies ceased dealing with Wikileaks) and has nothing to do with releasing 'secret' old files into the public domain. Some General (I've forgotten who) once said that World War 3 will be fought in cyberspace and conventional warfare will no longer exist. Could we be witnessing the first attempts to control western governments through cyberspace manipulation ? I'm also reminded that "what the eyes can't see the heart can't grieve over". History will judge the Past in this case

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 21:01

swannee7 wrote "they've hacked into the mainframe computers of large corporations"

and failed to take them down which shows that most large companies have prepared for such attacks

Middle Easter


Joined: 13/06/2007
Posts: 146

Message Posted:
10/12/2010 22:55

malsancak msg 32



No system is perfect, but the notional thought of being able to run the World through public opinion (which can be manipulated every which way) is a naive one.



The World can be a nasty unsafe place. Would you advoate that all M16 e-mails should be available on-line, whilst the Russian ex KGB or Isreali Mosad continue to percolate the corridors of power in the UK & beyond?



Maybe we should have 'phone in' vote on all policy matters? Also should we allow Britiish Muslims to vote on issues of Pakistan & Iraq......The wholw notional is absurd: Sure, no system is ideal: Our democratic system of government which release what is prudent, is the lesser of many evils.



Is' wikileaks' true or is it just ploy to re-focus the spolight on others..... the man in the street will never know. so, ;et the elected rulers rule & we should get on with living our lives

malsancak


Joined: 23/08/2009
Posts: 2874

Message Posted:
11/12/2010 09:15

Middle, if the Russian Government can read MI6 files then why can't we?

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
11/12/2010 11:02

msge 39



Interesting post.



There have always been the oppressed (the people) and oppressors (the rulers) and throughout history the oppressors have tried to topple the oppressors and the oppressors have tried to stay in power using a variety of means. This applies to countries as well. There are the oppressors (those on the security council) and the smaller developing countries.



What is different from the past (as Midlle Easter quite rightly allures to) is that the oppressed (in the West) can now vote for who they want to represent them (of course that choice can be limited) yet we still feel oppressed, and we believe that those who get in to power become (mysteriously) evil. So, even the oppressed are destined to become evil when they get in to power.

Just to build on what Middle Easter is saying, Churchill said something like 'democracy is a terrible system but it is the best political system out there.'



But to build on what you are saying Swanee, the internet has

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
11/12/2010 11:04

evened the game. The Oppressed (who are destined to become the oppressors) now have a means of fighting back.

walkerscott


Joined: 13/08/2009
Posts: 901

Message Posted:
11/12/2010 11:12

Espionage Act:

How the Government Can Engage in Serious Aggression Against the People of the United States



A real cause for concern. I wonder what old laws are kept from us by the UK Government?

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article27035.htm