Geneva Talks - Worthwhile?

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 11:42

Would love the thinking of the wise members of this board. For instance - is this another waste of time? Will this progress the cause of North Cyprus? Will this help resolve the 'cyprus problem', - or anything else you can think of, and more importantly 'Why?'.

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 20:08

Wot no one got any erudite thoughts? I was asked by a London Cypriot organisation as to what people think here, and I told them that as far as I kmnow they are not thinking at all - Come on guys, prove me wrong.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 20:15

http://www.cyprus44.com/forums/54040.asp



Sorry Maz,but this forum seems to have lost its political edge of late,

Paul.

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 22:48

Guess you are right, pAUL. pITY IT doesn't lose its critical edge as well!

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 23:13

well you know my thinking , waste of time and money . after two years they agree to disagree and are further away from an agreement than ever .



call it a day admit its divorce and both sides get on with it , simple as

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 23:35

Fair comment, Andy-f and a reflection of much heard around. Such a shame, cos it means that a lot of people get to go to Geneva for free, have some fun, but of little benefit to TRNC - or so seems to be the feeling of many,. But Downer seems to be pegging hopes on it - or is that because he is paid by U.N.?

Blackbird



Joined: 11/08/2009
Posts: 1432

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 23:41

Yes andy-f I also agree...it just isn't going t happen....

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
19/01/2011 23:47

maz , downer is banki -moons puppet . he cant say anything in public but i bet hes told mr moon and the other UN diplomats they are sleighing a dead horse here . the end game is being played out now for sure so lets wait and see what is said after this meeting in geneva. if you go to the link i posted on the thread " ergolu wants two sepperate states say the GCs " from the souths cyprus mail it says it all .





andy

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 00:30

Pretty sure you are right Andy. I reckon Downer would rather be back with his family in Oz than be wasting his time trying to get two locked antler stags to unlock and move forward. Think he knew it from day one, but it is a nice job, so.....

But of Eroglu wants two separate states, what does the man in the street want? Or doesn't that matter?

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 09:31

Maz - I think the question is: 'What does Turkey want?' The 'handful' of TC's left on this 'worldforsaken' 'no man's land' have no say in the matter - even if they come under the category of the 'Rich Club'; so, it doesn't matter!



As an aside - when one sees all these hordes of screaming school children pouring out of the gates of all the various schools, one can only wonder what on earth they are going to do for careers since the tourism and construction trades have deteriorated to a mere trickle - has anyone any ideas?

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 13:09

A very valid point about future careers. Not only that, one can talk of 'future economy'. If partition happens, and Turkey withdraws much financial aid, what industry is there here to support the existing adult,s let alone the adults of tomorrow. Or do the kids all go to America/U.K/Turkey and leave this as a poverty stricken land of pensioners.

kavenkoy


Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 1787

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 16:59

Maybe Maz both sides are following a plan allready layed for them .



In this lifetime maybe they dont want any form of settlement.



it allways appears strange both sides publicly say they want a settlement ,but both dont compromise ?

or that its took 40 years allready to have the same result .



may be the" play" is acted out under orders from UN and EU to justify subsides thats received.



I dont know i live for today ,have a beer and enjoy the sun



on a day in republica de mancunia its -2 and freezing fog ....i know where i want to be



take care

kav

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 19:15

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/cyprus/flurry-activity-ahead-geneva-meeting/20110120



seems like a lot more international influence beging to surface



andy

CJtill


Joined: 02/05/2008
Posts: 836

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 19:35

Now call me cynical if you wish, but......

I am sure whatever the answer is, it will cost us all a truck load of cash.

Michael

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 20:03

Roll on Jan 26th,and end this charade,

Paul.

andre514


Joined: 05/10/2010
Posts: 763

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 20:44

again, people seem to find it simpler to look at form not substance



true, talks of a sort have characterised the modern history of the island

then again the sides have implacably opposed objectives, don't they?



so we may ask ourselves what it is that the "progressives" may really be after?

some want to ease the separation with friends and ikea, lidl etc in the south

a few are using the false dawn of an "agreement" to scare property owners,

but many are just good-hearted souls oblivious to the realities of power play



speaking for myself I'd align my self with the "skeptics" on cyprus and turkey/eu

...perhaps I'm sad about that, but who cares what we think anyway?

kavenkoy


Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 1787

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 21:02

message 13



andy that just the gc spin doctors at work again......they like to blow smoke up their own arses



kav

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 21:31

Re- mess 16,



"But who cares what we think anyway" Que sera sera Andre.Who are we but mere mortals.

What will be will be,

Paul.

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:06

i just hope the UN and mr moon dont get cold feet and make out something worthwhile has come out of it which he seemed to do after new york when infact hes very dissapointed but declares another round of endless talks .

andre514


Joined: 05/10/2010
Posts: 763

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:23

andy-f it is beginning to look like much a self-sustaining industry isn't it?

a bloke I know says he likes north cyprus just the way it is

...and I find it hard to disagree!

cue the people quick to point out how maddeningly chaotic the place is

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:23

The truth is; after more than 40 years of negotiations ( I believe it started back in 1970 or was it 69 - not sure now), Cyprus problem has turned into one of those knots when I was tring to undo my shoe laces as a child. The more I pulled to undo the ruddy things, the tighter they got. So I used to force my foot into the shoe without untying it!



One thing for sure, there will not be an agreement in our life time...

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:36

i had a chat with somone recently who lives in the TRNC while he was over here in the uk , he said the only people who take an interest in these talks and any issues connected with it are brits who have purchased a holliday home there . hes lived in turkish cyprus six years and says he doesnt even bother reading about it any more and he thinks it will go on and on and on .

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:48

Not strictly true Andy. I know TC's here and in London and in Australia who are VERY concerne,d including of course the very large organisation ATCA who have asked people to sign their partition begging the leaders to go for Plan B (Partition). Baroness Meral Ece, herself a TC does her best to inform at Westminster so people that count can see truth. She does this by organising debates on Turkey (great one last week to which people like Lord Macginnis contributed. But equally many TC's and GC's come to that, want things to stay the same. Life styles are different but acceptable and there is great fear that trying to put Humpty Dumpty together again will results in greater pain than the current status quo.

Yes, everyone gets fed up reading the endless reams of words that don't begin to reach the light at the end of the tunnel, and don't create it either, but many are DEEPLY concerned as to just WHAT the future will be. Our property issues matter, but there is a larger picture that c

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:50

/ cont.....

that could become a horror story.



And one of the reasons I am asking people their thoughtsbecause organisations in London want feedback on feelings out here.



So, keep em coming.



HOnestly, there are politicians in London who CARE and they care about the ex pats here. Don't forget that many of the London Cyps are ex pats too, and they get quicjkly disillusioned and go back - another fear for the future. Will North Cyprus end up as a poverty stricken state full of penniless pensioners?

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
20/01/2011 23:51

fair point maz i cant argue with anything in above post .



andy

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 00:44

The Embargoed.org statement on its web page says it all -



EMBARGOED!

Since 04 March 1964

The plight of Turkish Cypriots has been ignored by the international community since the Cyprus conflict broke out in December 1963 and a badly drafted UN resolution on 4 March 1964 ignored their political equality.

46 years on, they continue to live under international isolation, forcing them to exist as second class citizens in their homeland.

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 00:56

International community EU appear to have only given recognition to Greece supported Enosis and Eoka campaigns on the Island and its support only to ROC.

rdsteve


Joined: 01/03/2009
Posts: 187

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 08:05

Mess 27

Your statement is not true. If the EU only supports the ROC why has it given all that money to the TRNC to improve roads and other infrastructure. The EU recognises Cyprus as one island not as 2 separate countries. If there is separation to 2 states will the EU still give money to TRNC ?. Turkey may not leave TRNC high & dry but it cannot sustain the kind of financial support it has done for many years. Even if the country is partitioned and TRNC recognised by the rest of the world what has the TRNC got to export to sustain it's own economy? Building and Tourism on both sides has collapsed due to greed and those of us that have bought property here and help support the economy have probably got a white elephant around our necks for many years to come. One of the biggest problems on this Island is the Brits that whinge and moan on these forums about insignificant things and yes again it is on both sides. No one forced you to settle here get on with life or go back to the UK

professoregit


Joined: 30/08/2008
Posts: 381

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 08:08

Used to be optimistic on a deal but having lived here and followed the dialogue for the last 6 years, I have to say things are no better than 6 years ago. Unfortunately its looks as though all relevant sides will lose out. Refer you to the following article, IMO serious stuff. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/c7bf6898-2480-11e0-8c0e-00144feab49a.html#axzz1Be3bKSv5

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 14:02

Since 2004 the EU which recognises Cyprus as a whole entity declared its intentions to assist in reducing the economic isolation of Northern Cyprus and began giving aid to the area, some 250 million in an attempt to raise standards in line with ROC and other member states.

The TRNC is similar to ROC in its capabilities to trade but impacted by Embargoe by the International Community.

Such isolation is only supported by Turkey EU Candidate State and not afforded the full benefits that ROC EU Member State is granted and receives with open arms.



My only 'whinge' as ever is for a similar EU blue flag creditation and support towards the beaches of North Cyprus. Perhaps i am only dreaming back to the good old days and how i remember through my eyes as a child in the early 70's just how beautiful and clean they were.

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 14:19

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Cyprus

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 14:30

Blue Flag Beaches



http://www.cyprusflag.net/cyprus-blue-flags.html



Such recognition should be expected in the TRNC.

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
21/01/2011 23:45

Cyprus Chill is right to quote Embargoed! How many of you are members of the one organisation that is non-political but really does try to get the Jack Straws of this world to keep their promises of the lifting of embargoes? But of course, the hopeful believe that the Geneva meeting will put Embargoed! out of business as all the Cyprus Problem is solved in one short round of talks.



Oops, another pig flew by the window!

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
23/01/2011 20:07

http://www.cyprusupdates.com/2011/01/eroglu-to-propose-a-linguistic-division-in-geneva/

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
23/01/2011 20:16

Chrsitfias had a perfect opprotunity to have an agreement with Talat, instead he started pissing in the wind and wasting time on Governence. He proposed something even his own people would not vote for.

The chance has gone.

Judging by how TRNC assets are being sold toTurkey on the cheap, it looks like we'll be the 68th province of Turkey.

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
23/01/2011 21:13

B ut many TC's don't want to lose their birthright (Cyprus) and become Turkish.

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
23/01/2011 21:14

Maz will it come to that . xx

Maz


Joined: 29/03/2009
Posts: 1924

Message Posted:
23/01/2011 21:48

There are a lot of people, Lilli, who are wondering what on eaxrth will happen. With Erogolu's latest idea of a bi-lingual state (those speaking Turkish on one side, those speaking Greek on another - and presumably us not allowed!!!!) when on earth will, and how, a proper solution be found. All this time, and nothing. Being in with Turkey is what manuy people think is the answer. Being independent is another. What economy have we got? Nothing to support us - just the same as Wales! But many think Turkey is the answer. Shucks!