21st March 2011 for fun in court

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 00:02

Many people have expressed an interest in my speeding trial that is set for 21st March 2011.

I appeared before the judge first time on 7th January and the judge asked me what I intended to do. I said that I was going to plead "not guilty". She asked me if I was driving the car that day and I said that I don't know because the police were not able to show me the picture at Famagusta Police Station. The attorney intervened to say that he will be happy to show me the picture but I said that its too late and I intend to object to the submission of the picture during the trial. The attorney argued that the police has no duty to show the picture but I thought otherwise. The case was postponed to 3rd February for pleading.



On 3rd. February the attorney asked for another postponement but I objected vehemently and said that there is no valid reason for the postponement. I wanted to be accused and plead accordingly. So I was accuse and I pleaded "not guilty" and the judge gave 21st March as a "clear" day for the trial. She thinks that she can finish it in one day but I told her that I expect at least 3-4 sittings. Obviously she does not know what she is in for

ismet

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 00:25

Good Luck Ismet.

halffull


Joined: 26/01/2009
Posts: 571

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 00:34

Best of luck Ismet.:=)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:00

I think police have to show the picture if you demand to see it. It is a case of you going to the Central station where these pictures are supposed to be kept. If this is a speeding fine - I have heard that the police are not very happy with the system either. They are constantly having to play the role of book-keepers and chase fines for privately owned speed cameras, instead of carrying out policing duties.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:12

At the time I asked for ther picture they told me that I had to go to Nicosia Police Headquarters between 4-5 p.m. for those from Famagusta District and also pay a fee. I said "No thank you". At that point the sergeant lifted up his head, looked at me and said "I know you, when I was a new policeman you gave me a very hard time in court for booking you for something. You will get them to alter the system and show the pictures here as well". I promised him that I will do so. Now I have to keep my promise, a promise is a promise

ismet

Blackbird



Joined: 11/08/2009
Posts: 1432

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:13

............Over here the pictures are really clear........Best of luck............

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:30

As far as the picture is concerned I am relying on the principle of "Natural Justice". According to this rule, it is well documented that unless it is against Public Interest, the police has to give you all the evidence against you. I belive that according to this rule the picture should accompany the initial ticket. At least it should be available at my local police headquarters and free of charge. We will see.

ismet

shrimp


Joined: 01/09/2010
Posts: 939

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:34

I will bring a cake, what time are visiting hours........I jest, good luck!!

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:36

Shrimp,

No worries, no prison sentence for it but they may take my driving license away for a few months. Will you be my personal driver for that time ?

ismet

shrimp


Joined: 01/09/2010
Posts: 939

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:42

no worries, of course I will....any excuse to visit the land of my birth...........x

wanderer


Joined: 05/02/2009
Posts: 1653

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 01:58

I saw my speeding picture free of charge in Nicosia Police head quarters

They were very nice and helpful up on the third floor they got a nice lady to translate

The picture was clear and showed my wife's face as passenger

I'm six foot so I sit back in my seat with seat fully back with arms extended in a Focus hire car

I recognised my jumper sleeves but no face the camera is the one by the army base going to Girni from Ercan

Ismet how far back your car seat ?

might be time to get a new distinctive coat for court so that your sleeves aren't recognised

If the judge allows late introduction of the photo evidence

Good luck

Ps I know I broke the limit that day I'd just landed and forgot the camera I swore as I went through 72 in a 50 limit that was march 6 more ins and outs and they told me in October 180 TL for the fine

berilela


Joined: 17/07/2010
Posts: 590

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 08:58

good luck shame we dont have lots more like you xxx

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 12:11

Wanderer,

The photo is only one of a dozen of excuses (defences). What about the loophole in the law which I used before and got an acquittal? Do you think they changed it? No way, business as usual!!! What about maintenance etc. etc.

ismet

PS: People used to say I am as good as an advocate. Now I take it as an insult

MaggieAndBernie



Joined: 26/07/2008
Posts: 2012

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 13:56

Good luck Ismet! x

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 15:55

I promise everybody a very enjoyable trial. I will have the police wittnesses on the run. You should all come and watch even if you do not understand a word of Turkish

ismet

PeeCee


Joined: 16/03/2009
Posts: 133

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 16:02

Good Luck. I'm sure that you will give them a well deserved hard time!

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
20/03/2011 20:06

Well, its 21st March tomorrow. Let's see if the attorney will have his witnesses ready for the trial. I won't be surprised if he comes up with an excuse just to get a postponemet. Maybe not because he knows that I will not give up. Let's go go go. Full report tomorrow whatever happens!

ismet

metin


Joined: 08/09/2008
Posts: 1588

Message Posted:
20/03/2011 20:15

Best of luck, will be waiting to hear the outcome !!!!

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
20/03/2011 20:22

good luck love. Or I think they will need the luck coming up against you. Cant wait for your report xxxx

philbailey


Joined: 17/01/2011
Posts: 3534

Message Posted:
20/03/2011 20:23

Is this a loop hole in the law ?

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
20/03/2011 21:59

msg. 20

I checked trhe latest situation on the relevant law and found out that surprise surprise they closed the loophole that I used last time. So they do some work occasionally but I have quite a few tricks up my sleeve, let's see.

ismet

PS: If they take away my license I may have to hire a driver, any volunteers? She will have to be under 30

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
20/03/2011 22:01

Good luck Ismet. You can do it! )

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 15:44

I am just back home and not in prison.

I was in court prompt at 8.30 am. At 10 am the judge asked the attorney what the situation is with my case and he said he has the pictures which he passed on to the judge but I was in a good position to see them. The photo was taken from the back and you could not see anything about the driver or the passenger. So the judge said she will look at my case at 11 am. I came back at 11 am but the judge was really busy with all the backlog from the strikes, busy postponing them. So she told me to come back at 1.30 pm whcih I did. She entered the court room and I took my place in the box for the accused. She asked me if I saw the pictures. I said that I saw them unofficially and my position is that I will object them to be put in as evidence during the trial because they were not shown to me in the first place. I base my argument on the fact that according to the "Natural Justice" Principle, all evidence must be given to the accused unless it is against public policy

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 15:51

ctd.

She asked me if I was driving the car at the time and again I said "I do not know. Apart from me my wife, my son and my son in law uses it and I do not keep a log book for the car". The judge said that in the absence of proof to the contrary, I am presumed to be the driver. I begged to differ. I will have to teach them what "presumption" means in law. For excample if you hear a gun shot coming from a room and then you see a man with a gun in his hand coming out of the room, then it is presumed in law that the person holding the gun did fire it. To make the same analogy to my car and to presume that I was the driver is utter nonsense.



She asked me what other defence I had and I said "Plenty".



The attorney intervened and accused me of staging a show, otherwise I should give my other defence. so I did. The cameras were put in position without a law to back it up i.e. they are illegal. The cameras are not maintained properly. They are not subject to strict

Linnyloos


Joined: 30/11/2008
Posts: 483

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 15:53

Good Luck and hope you get the result you deserve. Wish there were more people like you x

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 15:58

ctd.

subject to strict rules as it is in UK.



The attorney was really pissed off and said that this is not a case of speeding but something else. If I have any complaints about non maintenance of these cameras I should write to the papers and complain about it. I thanked him for the advice but I rather not use it



Then the attorney went off to explain how busy he is, he has four rapes to deal with and my speeding was not important at all. He said that he was sure I would appeal, hence I would keep him even more busy. I said that my case can wait and would not object it to be postponed for 6 months. The judge postponed it to 30th May and asked the police wittness to attend.



So its all set for 30th May. Now that they have the picture taken from the back, I am even more sure of the outcome. Once I go to town on "presumption", it should be quite easy to convince her to change her mind, otherwise she will run the risk of an appeal with a multitude of other points.

ismet

negativenick


Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 6023

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 16:02

ismet - you shine out like a shaft of gold when all around is dark...........

Snaefell



Joined: 07/06/2009
Posts: 266

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 16:03

Good luck Ismet, I hope it goes well for you.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 16:43

Well done Ismet. I'm proud of you.

pollymarples


Joined: 08/08/2010
Posts: 1778

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 18:07

Ismet will you come to court with me if I ever get prosecuted over my writing, I think you could talk your way

out of a paper bag. You do make me laugh.

Jeannie


Joined: 04/08/2009
Posts: 3283

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 18:10

Ismet - you are, without doubt, a star

tomsteel


Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 482

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 18:36

URA*. If only other like-minded TRNC citizens could get together to sort out the many 'civil' iniquities found here.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 18:51

Polly,

I wish I could represent you in court but not allowed to.

ismet

cypgab


Joined: 09/01/2010
Posts: 338

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 19:04

Why do I feel uneasy about a person who has committed an offence (which could cause fatalities) and yet gloats about the way he is dealing with it.



Tell me Elko, if you had run over some whilst speeding would you still defend it?



I have great admiration for you and the things you do, but this is wrong.

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 19:18

Cypgab, you are presuming Ismet is guilty. The presumption of innocence until proven otherwise is very important. If the equipment being used to find people guilty of speeding is not properly serviced and calibrated then it deserves to be disallowed.

philbailey


Joined: 17/01/2011
Posts: 3534

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 19:33

So can I ask where all 10/12? speeding fines wrong?

cooper


Joined: 23/10/2007
Posts: 3386

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 21:07

Personally ismet i would lock you up and throw away the bloody key )

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 21:38

With the greatest respect ismet abi ,what point are you trying to portray ,and why if you were speeding then why not just own up and pay up.



speeding kills and that,s why we have camera,s .





musin



long live the kktc

gooligan


Joined: 30/01/2007
Posts: 1591

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 21:54

Musin,bad drivers and unroadworthy cars kills more.

Johnatcastle


Joined: 23/07/2009
Posts: 163

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 22:06

I too feel Ismet is sailing close to the wind on this one! QUOTE: I will have to teach them what "presumption" means in law. For excample if you hear a gun shot coming from a room and then you see a man with a gun in his hand coming out of the room, then it is presumed in law that the person holding the gun did fire it. To make the same analogy to my car and to presume that I was the driver is utter nonsense. ????

To assume the person who owns the car is driving seems reasonable to me unless the owner can provide the name of the person driving it at the time. It seems that you are frivolously using up the courts time when they clearly have a backlog of cases. Natural justice to me means if I commited the crime and got caught (which is exactly what has happened here as Ismet has actually never denied driving the car!) then I should accept the punishment. The trouble with the law (especially in UK at the moment) is that people seem to feel that it is just a case of : CONT:

Zoots


Joined: 05/02/2011
Posts: 669

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 22:09

Yes, guns don't kill - people do.

Johnatcastle


Joined: 23/07/2009
Posts: 163

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 22:12

"Finding a loophole" !!! Surely that is not in the spirit of the law.

Ismet, I normally agree with 99% of what you post on here and I find you an interesting and helpful member, but on this ocassion I find myself a little concerned about motives. Is it actually just getting off the fines you are aiming at or is it actually a changing of the law?? We can argue all day about the 'legalities' of cameras, maintenence, sites, etc but on a purley 'natural justice' perspective, YOU SPEED, YOU GET CAUGHT, YOU PAY FINE. Just worming out of it on a 'technicality' seems to me to be unjust'

If that man holding that gun had shot a member of your family (god forbid) and he got off because of a minor technicality, even though he was CLEARLY GUILTY would that be justice???

philbailey


Joined: 17/01/2011
Posts: 3534

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 22:13

“According to our research, speeding could be responsible for as many as 11,000 deaths in the EU every year. However, in countries where a safety camera network has been implemented, deaths and injuries as a result of speeding have dropped significantly.”

Reducing your speed by just 5% could reduce road deaths by 20% and injuries by 10%. But breaking the speed limit by just 5km/h could mean the difference between life or death for pedestrians, cyclists or unrestrained passengers travelling in the car. Hit by a car at 60km/h, 9 out of 10 pedestrians will be killed.



http://www.rsa.ie/Utility/News/2010/Speeding-a-factor-in-11000-deaths-on-EU-roads-every-year/



msg 39 sorry to prove otherwise

McSteviet



Joined: 11/05/2007
Posts: 1089

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 22:51

Are the Kyrenia courts back in Business now after all the strikes? and they all over now, i.e. whatever the dispute was, is now resolved??



MC

Johnatcastle


Joined: 23/07/2009
Posts: 163

Message Posted:
21/03/2011 23:56

Just been thinking about this in the shower (yes sad I know) If you wore a balaclava or mask whilst driving and got caught by a speed camera would this be a defence as they can't see that it's you driving??? Just imagine all those people driving around with Tony Blair or Maggie Thatcher masks on (or worse)..LOL...

Not sure whether to say good luck or not to you Elko but my best regards to you anyway. . .

cypgab


Joined: 09/01/2010
Posts: 338

Message Posted:
22/03/2011 10:11

Groucho quote: Cypgab, you are presuming Ismet is guilty. The presumption of innocence until proven otherwise is very important. If the equipment being used to find people guilty of speeding is not properly serviced and calibrated then it deserves to be disallowed.



Ismet is not denying he speeds - in fact he seems to be very proud of it. Reread his words, you'll see it shining through.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
22/03/2011 19:28

You all make it sound as though I break the speed limit deliberately. I pass by the cameras about 1000 times in a year and I got caught about 5 or less in a year. If these cameras actually measured the average speed over a distance, I would not have a single ticket. Its just that occasionally I forget to slow down just before a camera.



All good lawyers are good at finding loopholes and I feel that I am as good as any although I am not a lawyer. Of course speeding is bad but we all go over the limit on very rare occasions but some of us get caught by the cameras because we have too much on our minds and miss the camera. That does not automatically make us bad drivers. I have been driving over 45 years and never had an accident (so far). So please let us keep things in proportion.

ismet

philbailey


Joined: 17/01/2011
Posts: 3534

Message Posted:
22/03/2011 19:33

Try living in the uk you will pass 100 per day .

And yes they have ave speed cameras from point to point

the amount of cameras is no excuse

but I wish you luck beating the law

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
22/03/2011 19:35

Ismet

'although I am not a lawyer'

But you do sleep with one! Damn pillow talk!



Richard

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 10:26

I see Oxford (almost certain that is right) are recommissioning their speed cameras as accident rates have risen without them.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 11:34

I hope they take pictures from the front each time and not sometimes from the back and try to decide on who is the driver on "a balance of probabilities". Criminal cases have to be decided on "proof beyond reasonable doubt".

ismet

AnthonySmith


Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 455

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 11:38

Ismet, your comment: "Its just that occasionally I forget to slow down just before a camera."



But you're are speeding. You are driving above the officially recognised "safe" speed for that stretch of road. That is why cameras, and I'm no fan, were introduced.



If people drove sensibly - and look how many people died and were badly injured on North Cyprus roads alone last year - there would not be any need for cameras. People don't and always look to blame everyone or everything else.



Or look for loopholes ;-)

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 12:28

If there aren't already enough 'judder bars' ['Sleeping Policemen'] on TRNC roads, they could put them in accident 'blackspots'; however, it's blatantly obvious that all these speed cameras are simply put there to generate revenue, whereas 'judder bars' don't.



Obtaining money by deception seems to be a forte of TRNC!



'It's simply NOT cricket, old chap - is it?'

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 15:17

Anthony,

Basically I am not in disagreement with you and I try to be as careful as anybody else. Having said that, a) I prefer the average speed cameras over a stretch of a road as more sensible and more effective in controlling speeding, b) I do not want the justice system to lower its values for the sake of efficiency i.e. I want to keep the age old "proof beyond reasonable doubt" in criminal cases including traffic c) the use of loopholes serves the public interest in the long run and results in better legistlation. Some loopholes have been closed thanks to me.



Ten: I am not against speed cameras, they serve a useful purpose.

ismet

luem1


Joined: 29/07/2009
Posts: 109

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 17:13

Elko,



On this one I'm afraid you are wrong on a question of law.



In the UK, traffic offences are determined on a balance of probabilities, not on proof beyond reasonable doubt.

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 17:51

Ismet

Just for your information.

The system on the French motorway system is that a car is clocked/photographed with a ticket and then timed from payage to payage (toll) and if it's quicker than the mean speed limit twixt the two, you're fined! The flaw in that system is that there are many Aires de repos (picnic/toilet areas) and Aires de servis (full blown motorway service stations) between the toll booths, so the clever driver wanting to test out the latest purchased car model boots it like hell for awhile, stops for a break before reaching the next payage.

Happy driving when you're next in France!



Richard

AlsancakJack



Joined: 14/08/2008
Posts: 5762

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 19:11

Tenakoutou

Traffic calming measures such as 'sleeping policemen' or speed bumps are being removed , and quite rightly so, in a lot of countries because they severely reduce emergency vehicle response times (in particular ambulances that have to carry patients with life threatening spinal injuries).

kaiserphil


Joined: 14/12/2008
Posts: 1096

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 19:29

I see 'dryboak' is back - mess 50. That makes certainly 2, probably 3 alter egos on this thread alone. Moderators?

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 19:35

msg 55

Luem wrote: "In the UK, traffic offences are determined on a balance of probabilities, not on proof beyond reasonable doubt."



Are you really sure about this? Are you really saying that a person may lose his licence on a balance of probabilities? Do you have any references on this matter please?

ismet

rejela


Joined: 09/02/2011
Posts: 293

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 21:32

Ismet abi, I wonder, does the judge read the posts on this forum. If the answer is yes, has this publicity influenced the judge on his or her impending judgement.

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 21:33

Cygab calling, Cypgab calling ...................



Civil cases are found on the balance of probaliities. Traffic offences are criminal in the UK.





Message58 - keep up Kaiserphil.



I can't come in as Cypgab because my member email is not valid!!!!



No one has tried to help me rectify this and I can't get in to change it - because my email is .......



I would ask AJ but I'm not sure I would get a helpful answer.

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 22:04

Msg 61

. Traffic offences are criminal in the UK. (sic)

Wrong!

Not all of them, but many thanks for your erudite input and bow to the legal knowledge of British driving laws you are well acquainted with!



Richard

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
09/04/2011 23:39

Cypgab, msg 46



Re-read message 35 again and tell me where I said Ismet should be found not guilty in court. I did say "If the equipment being used to find people guilty of speeding is not properly serviced and calibrated then it deserves to be disallowed." This means nothing more than this:- If the data could be flawed because the installation is not adequately checked and there is no regime of maintenance that can be proven it should be ruled inadmissible and set aside. If disallowing the speed camera as evidence causes Ismet to be found not guilty by default then that's a matter for the lawmakers and the courts.



I feel uneasy about dodgy gear being used as Gospel evidence of an offence....

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 00:34

Message 63: ..tell me where I said in (message 46) where I say you said Ismet should be found not guilty ..



I don't think I said any such thing, in any case I don't really understand the question?





aka cypgab

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 00:42

Brinsley message 62.



The speeding offences we are talking about under this topic all come under criminal law. Most of the Road Traffic Act is criminal law, although some has been delegated to local authorites eg some parking. Which ones do you mean that don't come under criminal law.



Criminal law requires evidence beyond reasonable doubt, Civil law requires on the balance of probabilities.



' ..................erudite input and knowledge of British driving laws?' I like it.





aka cypgab

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 00:45

Msg 65

Absolute *****, I suggest you get yourself back to law school!



Richard

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 00:49

Definitions

1) Having or showing great knowledge gained from study and reading

2) Having or showing a high level of scholarly knowledge

3) Learned.

4) A person might like to be erudite but should hesitate to be rude.



Showing great deliberation and thought .................... I'll go for number 4.



aka Cypgab

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 00:56

Brinsley - that's a bit of a wild swing. To be kind I'll take the time of day into account.



Legal quote: All motoring offences (except parking violations in areas where enforcement has been handed over to local councils, rather than traffic wardens) come under criminal law. So there can be no doubt that speeding is a criminal offence.



aka cypgab

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 01:51

I have to agree with "dryboak" regarding motoring offenses. Most motoring offenses including speeding, except parking fines that are taken over by the local councils, are classified as criminal offenses in UK. The only difference between these and other criminal offenses is that, although criminal, they are not recorded! In other words, your criminal record will never show any motoring convictions and/or fines.

With regards to all those considerate drivers protesting Ismet's stance, I disagree strongly with you all! As someone who constantly travels to Güzelyurt, Magosa, Lefkoşa and Ercan I am yet to find a convoy of cars traveling at or below the speed limits! By my judgement, more than 90 percent of drivers are breaking the law on these roads, on daily basis ( and I am sure that includes most of the above protesters). The fact that most are clever enough to slow down just before the camera, does not make them any better than others who forget to do so and end up getting fined (

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 01:54

Msg 68

Quote or unquote, ply yourself through the law books!



Richard

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 02:11

With regards to accidents on roads, I really have not seen any slowing down in the death and injury rate due to accidents in North Cyprus, since these (highway robbers) machines were installed. In fact they are just as bad as before, if not on the increase.

A private company made, and is still making a lot of money out of these machines. They are not police cameras - not even any council's! Yet the police are doing all the paperwork and chasing the matter all the way to the court! So if the police are acting like the soldiers of Sheriff of Nottingham, then İsmet has every right to behave like Robin Hood!

The other matter is of course, on many occasions when I had to pay a fine for something like being "12 km" over the limit (less than 7.5 mph), I could swear I was not speeding at the time, but gave them the benefit of the doubt - hence paying up. Like İsmet, I have also been driving for more than 30 years without having a single accident or harming anyone's property/person.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 02:28

As a driver who recently refused paying 5 fines (kept waiting up to 16 months and served to me at one go), I am also determined to follow in the food steps of İsmet and go all the way! These fines were during a period when a close family member was being very ill (who subsequently died), and when my car was used by everyone and anyone related, for daily trips to Girne and Lefkoşa Hospitals. After so long, I cannot remember who was driving the vehicle when the alleged offenses took place. Unlike İsmet, I paid 45TL to see the photos AND none of them showed me as the driver! (i.e. the driver was not visible at all).

Even if it means going to prison, I shall refuse to contribute to the wealth of some close relative/friend of some TRNC minister - who was favored to install these machines. For everyone's information, death and injury due to speeding in South Cyprus is much less than that in the North - and THEY DO NOT HAVE any such speed cameras!

philbailey


Joined: 17/01/2011
Posts: 3534

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 02:38

Msg 72 , I was stopped for speeding in Bexley village when my partner had cancer and I was driving (urgently) to St.Thomas hostipal , I went to court and explained the situation

I got 5 points for 45 in a 30 zone

because I took it to court

dryboak


Joined: 05/04/2011
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 09:47

Brindsley, or can I call you Dick?



That's an obscenity, a nitpick, wrong in law and personal insults. All from you in this one thread!



You obviously have a strongly held point of view but unless you can back it up it's like shooting blanks. All noise and no substance.



We could have a reasonable discussion if you allowed it.



aka cypgab

honestie


Joined: 22/02/2009
Posts: 468

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 13:52

message 69



you are correct traffic offences come under the criminal court system and rules beyond all resdonalbe doubt and not the civil law court . Although under the criminal law system they are not shown as convictions as in what most people think of as crime unless you are disaualified as a result of traffic offences then it it becomes a criminal conviction.



even the parking tickets which are now under the local authority if contested go via the criminal court system .



hope this clarifies it.

keithr


Joined: 20/08/2008
Posts: 720

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 14:38

When I lived in that craphole called England,I went to the Le Mans 24 hour race for many years, It was hilarious seeing all the Ferraris and Lambos parked up a kilometer before the toll,having a fag....

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 17:08

msg 69 Big oz,

I am in full agreement with you. Furthermore 69 is my favourite number at the moment because I was born in 1942 which makes me 69

ismet

AnthonySmith


Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 455

Message Posted:
10/04/2011 17:12

And Ismet, I was born in 1969, which makes me 42. Isn't that a coincidence ;-)

jonnymarsbar


Joined: 04/07/2011
Posts: 7

Message Posted:
04/07/2011 09:20

Hi elko 2,



I have just returned from a holiday in NC and I was staggered by the forest of camera's that seem to have sprouted in the last 5 years and I think that I have been clocked by a couple of them during my visit.



This Forum has been very helpful and I now understand that for me to sort these tickets it will have to wait until my next visit to NC when I can go to Police Station. However I have followed your progress through the legal system with great interest but I think your assertion that as your face is not visable then the case cannot be proven could be risky.



In the UK the assumption is that the registered driver is resposible. If the registered driver does not give details of the actual driver then they will be the one fined and this applies to all vehicles. If you let me know your email then I will send you a picture I have from a UK camera of my car from the rear (Most UK cameras are from the rear) so it was £60 and 3 points, ta very much.



Good Luck, jonny