Erdogan voices concern about the North

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 17:39

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/cyprus/erdogan-lambasts-ungrateful-north/20110205





Can Northern Cyprus really afford to bite the hand that feeds,

Paul.

Pugwash


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 1797

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 17:43

No Paul it can not.

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 17:45

Paul, you are absolutely right if the public sector workers carry on like this then i fear the hand that feeds them will give a slap instead.



The South will be lovin this ?

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 17:46

http://www.google.com/url?sa=X&q= http://news.az/articles/turkey/30917&ct=ga&cad=CAEQAhgAIAAoATAAOABArtm16gRIAVAAWABiBWVuLUdC&cd=f7ibtoDrxu4&usg=AFQjCNGkUUsiBmG6VvN7KxgFW6-jFaPYgQ

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 17:49

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=erdogan+comments+on+anti-turkey+banner+in+cyprus&hl=en&rlz=1T4ACAW_en___GB401&prmd=ivnsu&source=univ&tbs=nws:1&tbo=u&ei=J3FNTYvoPIKHhQeBtICGDw&sa=X&oi=news_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCYQqAIwAA

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:15

TRNC can chew up the hand that feeds it and spit it out. Who does he think he is telling us that we have no right to demonstrate and say what we feel. He is allowed to say we are ungrateful but I beg to differ. Bases in Cyprus do not come cheap Mr Eddy pay up or get out. Bu memleket Bizim. Don't you never forget it.



This is not Turkey yet. Let them cut all the money, and see how long he will last. It is not the first time this threat has been used but never had the balls to carry it out.

At the moment only a very small percentage is against Turkish presence in Cyprus, but it can change and very quickly. Our younger generation is as demanding as anywhere else.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:22

Fred,please tell me how Northern Cyprus would survive without the money they receive from Turkey,

Paul.

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:25

YFred, TC,s are fully entitled to voice or action their views however if push comes to shove who will keep the peace if Turkey withdraw its support.



Maybe perhaps people want Turkey to leave and Cyprus to return to some sort of pre 74 existance so be it but be careful what you wish for

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:31

Yfred...with all due respect I think you seriously overestimate the power of Northern Cyprus to look after itself and manage it's own destiny.



Without Turkey's ongoing assistance you would be struggling within a matter of months.....if all those TRNC public servants didn't have their wages paid by Turkey for 6 months there would be chaos.



As an unrecognised embargoed country, Turkey has been your saviour whether you care to admit it or not.



Without them,which other international friend could you turn to?



Surely even you are not naive enough to think that Northern Cyprus could be self-sufficient?

From what?......Tourism?.....Construction?.....

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:43

My dear friends. You seem to forget the Turkish Cypriots came to within 87% of self sufficiency before Turkey pushed us back into further dependency. When you tie someones hands behind their backs, surely you have responsibility to feed them. Instead of helping us to stand on our own feet, they put all sorts of obstacles to suffocate us. With friends like that who needs enemies. By all means if they want to have bases, we can negotiate, I hear China is also looking for bases in the vicinity.

Pre-63, we survived without any help. It is not a coincidence that we find ourselves in this position. Turkey is fully responsible for what has happened to us. After all they armed and financed the mayhem that is one part of the Cyprus problem and Greece for the other side.

I really do wish they pack up their bags and go. If the Greek Cypriots start another war, we will worry about it then.

I don't believe they will, in fact it will help to get a settlement

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:45

It is without doubt the case that the TRNC is relliant upon finnancial assistance from Turkey.

Turkish military presence provides security to the embargoed region.

If Turkey were indeed to remove either financial or military security then a state of caos would soon transpire.

The TRNC simply does not have the freedom, economic security or inner strength to protect itself from close by waiting predators.



I personally do not think that Turkey will take action because of its pride of position against the ROC. Certainly the TRNC must strive harder to attain a postion of self sufficiency. Not enough is being done to relieve itself of embargo. To criticise Turkey is certainly no route to attaing its asspirations.

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 18:59

paul



there is no such thing as a free lunch ,what turkey is paying the north for what they get in return is a pittance.



as for democracy don,t knock it .



cronos



self-sufficient ,means self sufficient .

turkey will never let cyprus go and if you believe it,s love think again ,so for those gc,s getting excited

don,t hold you breath.



musin



long live the kttc

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:02

The RoC has equal responsibility for the embargoes as Turkey. They are both as bad as each other. We don't need either. We have survived before and we will survive again but not if the embargoes are not removed. That is the UN responsibility. If they refuse to remove the embargoes, perhaps it's time we told the UN what we think of them properly.

Like I said, the Turks can go anytime they please. Either put up or shut up is my answer to my Eddoturkallo friend.

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:06

Musin....I don't really understand your reply, but then as a Yorkshireman I often struggle with the London dialect !



I don't think Turkey WILL let Northern Cyprus go, but what it will do is make them toe the line and quash the superiority complex that many seem to have......both full time and part time TC's !

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:10

But that is exactly the point YFred.....There are embargoes and without Turkey the North is stuffed.



So lets say you get your wish and Turkey pack up and head home are the EU going to lift the embargoes and recognise TRNC as a seperate state......dont bet on it !.



Tell the UN what you like but will they listen......dont bet on that either.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:15

With Turkey gone, Greek Cypriots have no excuse for embargoes. As far as UN listening is concerned we have a special way of removing earwax, free of charge.

What will the EU do, sit back and watch the Turkish Cypriot starve to death? We will survive the same was as the Palestinians survive.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:18

Cronos, E by Gum Lad. Do not worry about Turkey doing anything. Before then Eddoturkallo will suddenly fall ill and retire due to family reasons.

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:19

Yfred.....but why would Turkish Cypriots starve to death?



Are you saying that you COULDN'T manage without Turkey?

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:21

No you guys were suggesting it. Did I get that wrong?

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:25

So let me get this right...Turkey gone,.....embargoes still on,......no means of TRNC earning a living and the RoC standing by watching ?





YFred........... You ever visited the planet earth

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:31

Turtle, more than you have that's for sure. Were you there when we were enclaved into 2.5% of Cyprus with no Turkish soldiers anywhere, pre 74. Did we not survive then? At least now we are not scattered all over but are one unit with plenty of land. You have no idea my friend.

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:31

turtle

you have not understood what yfred has said ,with turkey gone the roc will lift the embargos which they have stated, or maybe we can,t trust them,lol.



now let,s put this to bed ,hands up those who believe turkey will ever go.



musin



long live the kktc

Jovial_John


Joined: 31/01/2009
Posts: 1024

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:40

If Turkey goes there will be no embargos - because the rest of the world recognises the South's sovereignty over the North and the South will just walk in and resume control (what do you think those 200 main battle tanks are for - to invade Malta?). Then there will be the unified state that the UN, EU et al still believe exists. But unlike 1960, there will be no TC representation in government because the constitution of the Republic of Cyprus was changed by Makarios. And all pre-74 Greek Cypriot property will revert to its original owners and current occupiers will pay huge penalties (a la Orams) because it is South Cyprus courts that will decide everything.

This will result in the collapse of all TRNC businesses that have any property built on GC owned land and effectively TCs will have nothing - no work, no rights and no voice.

YFred - are you sure you want Turkey to go???

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:46

YFred....MSG21

Are you saying you want to return to THAT ?

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 19:47

jovial john



what a load of bull ,prehaps you forgotten the tc,s ,i can,t believe the rubbish you have written.







musin



long live the kktc

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 20:02

Musin, I know they will never leave, I am just toying with the idea if by a coincidence somebody performs a miracle and I am not even religious.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 20:07

Turtle, if I had said it, why would you be asking me? Of course I don't, I am pointing to you late comers to this godforsaken land of ours that the Turkish Cypriots have plenty of resolve. If the embargoes continue at least it is with 37.5 percent of the land and not 2.5 percent. Shall I write in in Greek for you if you like.

And if the gumha's south of the border try funny stuff, we can deal with them too even if they out numbers us by 2 to 1.

Dixie Normus


Joined: 22/02/2008
Posts: 820

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 20:08

The TC has been sucking off teet of the Turkish for that long it no longer has the ability to hold its own, cut the umbilical cord and watch the ungrateful die in their own vomit, the only time NC will be able to stand upon its own two feet is when a new phoenix rises from the ashes from a land that has been destroyed by the corrupt money grabbing parasites that want everything for little effort.



D.N

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 20:15

JJ Certainly I would like them to go but I also know for certain that no amount of wanting will make them go. Now, as far as 200 tanks are concerned, you should look at what happened to Israel when they walked into Lebanon with all the tanks and warplanes at their disposal. They lost plenty and couldn't get back out fast enough. In fact in order to free two soldiers they lost over 100. That was more than they lost in the last 10 years.

You can defeat an army but a popular uprising? I think not.

If you think the Greek Cypriots will just take it back and it will be the end, I beg to differ. Hell will freeze twice over. I shall say it to you in Greek, because I suspect you are one.

Anna yni san don shillon bu efaen do gatsoshiron.

For those who don't have a clue what it means - it will be like a dog eating a hedgehog.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 20:17

DN there is a lovely Greek phrase you should be aware of. Mahima je ksimahima en gonda gonda. Getting used to and un-getting used to is very near.

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 20:34

20 Tanks against what exactly........a few sticks and stones and the odd elderly gentlemen shouting obscenaties and pointing his finger at stelios should sort it ?

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 21:02

i think you lot should be more worried about turkey pushing you lot out .



stop under estimating the turkish cypriots, talk is cheap.





musin



long live the kktc

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 21:08

Musin,Fred,

I always enjoy reading your posts on here,but i have to say that i am sorry, but i cannot agree

with your views on this particular post.Why would you just want to survive as mentioned in

earlier posts,wouldnt it be better to thrive and therefore move forward.I am very familiar

with 74 and the enclaves.Sureley you dont want to go back to that scenario.Turkey pump

millions into the North,my advice would be to keep them sweet.Anyway the troops are going

nowhere,

Paul.

Dixie Normus


Joined: 22/02/2008
Posts: 820

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 21:18

YFred Ref msg 30,

Dont know where your coming from mate, but if you have a few grams for sale I'll have it off you, plus a pair of your rose tinted spec's.

Beware the hand of fortune that has stroked the lips of the leper, a slow and painful fall shall result from his excess.



D.N

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 21:37

paul



turkey is our motherland and i am not saying i want turkey out ,i am just annoyed when people say we are getting everything for free, we are not and if someone wants to strike or protest then they should be free too do so.



and yes you,me and anyone with any sense knows turkey are not going anywhere,not now not ever ,that will upset some of our greek friends on here.



musin



long live the kktc

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 21:38

Newlad, the Turks need Cyprus. Politically as well as Militarily. We are only playing a game of what if. Nobody is going anywhere. But if the Turks withdraw and the UN does not remove the embargo, then we shall do what ever is necessary to survive. I was merely pointing out that we survived circumstances a thousand times worse than now. I lived it. They would not allow baby milk and ambulances in to the villages. The truth hurts especially my southern cousins.



It's a bit of a pointless debate to be honest, we is just avin a lauf.



Turkey is split down the middle. Even if the government wants to pulls out, the deep state will not allow it. They will also not want the TCs to want independence either.

Magbs


Joined: 26/02/2009
Posts: 278

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 21:50

“Who do you [Turkish Cypriots] think you are? We have martyrs, heroes and strategic interests [on Cyprus].”



How a political leader can use that kind of language?

I find this statement offensive, humiliating or threatening which is qiute typical of one who takes any criticism as an insult to Turkey.

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:06

Yfred and Musin.....as usual you are so entrenched and blinkered in your views that you don't hear what others are actually saying......you slant it in your mind so that you can spout your usual rhetoric.



And it is always a good sign that you are losing the argument when you accuse anyone with critical views of the TRNC of being "Greek", "GC", or a "southern cousin".



Myself and others have argued that the TRNC would not survive financially without the support of Turkey.

You have turned this into a rant along the lines of "let them try it, they won't go, we don't need them, we've endured worse, we are survivors etc etc "



There is a great difference between being able to just SURVIVE on your own, and actually prospering as a self-determining civilised country.

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:08

I for one would love to see the TRNC become independant to stand on its own feet and to develope like any other country,..but that is some way off as we know so accept the pocket money and smile politely for now.



I dont live there so dont fully understand what goes on daily but life seems pretty ok around the place when I am there and people seem contented with life, perhaps someone can put me right if I'm wrong !

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:17

cronos



it,s you who is not listening ,no one is saying we can do this and we can do that ,what we are saying is if we had to survive on our own then we would have no choice but too and furthermore we have done so in the past.



it,s not about losing an argument or maybe it is for you ,but we are survivors and unlike what you think most tc,s are civillised.



musin



long live the kktc

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:21

Musin.....you are actually agreeing with me whilst still trying to maintain an argument !



I'm sure most TC's don't just want to survive...they want to grow and prosper.

Without Turkey you cannot do that.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:29

msg 37;

......and thats coming from someone who supposedly leading 72 million.

To me thats a good enough comment to turn majority of us against Turkey,if not all.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:39

for those that can read turkish,



http://www.starkibris.net/index.asp?haberID=83580

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 22:40

Paul ( Newlad )



This has been a very interesting topic.



I'm sure that a lot of foreigners like myself who became involved in the TRNC, automatically assumed that the Turkish Cypriots and Turks were fighting the same fight and had a symbiotic relationship.



I was genuinely shocked and surprised to learn how much resentment there is from TCs towards the mainland Turks......and how many of them have a much greater affinity with their original Cypriot "cousins" in the South.



That hostility towards Turkey is still alive and well on this Board from the more vocal TCs ..."British" or otherwise !

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
05/02/2011 23:38

cronos-msg 41;



"I'm sure most TC's don't just want to survive...they want to grow and prosper.



Without Turkey you cannot do that. "



Of course we can't,all the while they are accupiying us.

They were supposed to bring 'peace' to us and Greek Cypriots as well at the same time(Ecevit's own words in 1974)



37 years on and all we have to show for is 'cease fire'!

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 00:12

Yorgozlu...msg 45



That's exactly my point.



Most people, even those with some connection to the TRNC, would NOT think that TCs considered themselves to be "occupied" by Turkey, rather than "protected" or "supported".

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 00:26

cronos, I to am suprised with some of the content of some of the posts and have to agree with you that protection and support from Turkey was the order of the day but it appears not ?



My TC friends in and around Alsancak appear to have a totally different view to the ones expressed on here today it would be interesting to hear from more TC people to get a more balanced opinion.

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 00:27

Ankara should have annexed TRNC last Century!



Richard

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 01:11

What's all the hassle all about. There you were saying we can't survive without Turkey and now you are saying it is not enough. Of course we want more, but how can we with all the embargoes? We can hold our own so long as the playing field is equal. If Erdogan, doesn't like it, he can take a jump. If my cousins down south of the border don't like it, they can join him.

The whole international community sat by and watched us being enclaved and did bugger all. If it happens again, we'll do it again and UN the EU and the rest of the selfish world can get stuffed too.

There is no runting going on here, just some truths.

What is real shameful is the promise Eroglu gave to the Turkish Cypriots and did not keep it. Then again what did we expect?

Let us not forget that we only have a ceasefire not a peace agreement.

Here is another what if? Turkey pulls out, and Greek Cypriots attack the North, then Turkey comes back and takes the lot on account that they broke the ceasefire?

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 01:18

The comments you get depends on politics of the person. Do you really think all TCs have the same political views? It also depends on whether they benefited from the Turkish intervention or not. For instance my family did not esdeger deliberately, becasue we were offered a quarter of what we owned just on volume not price.

More and more TCs are begining to realise that their property in the south is far more valuable than what they got in the north, as well as a lot of people got land for being member of UBP when they had bugger all in the south.

I see some of you guys expect the TCs to have no opinion of their own. Well, I beg to differ one more time.



Right wing = pro Turkish

Left wing/Liberal = against

It's not that difficult.

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 02:33

Msg 50

'Right wing'?

I met 'Attila the Hun' and then turned right for real!



Richard

fireball


Joined: 10/12/2010
Posts: 107

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 16:15

yfred About time you took some reality pills. Only 3 options for TRNC

a) with Turkey

b) Go it alone

c) Join with greek Cypriots.

In reality only one option a above. b above well they have proven over the years tc's cant come anywhere near to substancial government/.

c above that is pure economical and political suicide.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
06/02/2011 19:33

Cronos,



Re mess 44,i too never realised that there was such resentment.Good sensible debate for the

post though,

Paul.

Zoots


Joined: 05/02/2011
Posts: 669

Message Posted:
07/02/2011 22:53

Cronos msg 44,



All it takes is getting to know a few TCs to realise how they feel about Turkey versus their cousins in the south. It's been that way for a very long time.