this much money from casinos

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:03

"A MAJOR casino owner in the north has accused the Turkish Cypriot authorities of being “coy” over the $500 million made annually from the gaming industry, and has called on the administration to devise a clear and workable policy on casinos. " from the cyprus mail



Does the TRNC government really make this much from casinos?

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:09

“In 2007, casinos in north Cyprus paid $75 million tax to the government, and directly or indirectly injected $500 million into the economy,” director of the Grand Casino Club, Aydogan Turay told the Turkish-language daily Hurriyet. Grand Club Casino is one of three casinos in the north owned by Turkish giant Net Holding, a company listed on the Istanbul Stock Exchange and which boasts 46 subsidiaries and over $255 million of foreign currency reserves."



Apologies it's 75 million in taxes

Chessman


Joined: 13/05/2008
Posts: 486

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:10

suzanne.



Because he is considerate?

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:17

Thanks Geoff - hope you are well

brian24001


Joined: 23/03/2008
Posts: 606

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:22

Lets say that the tax (on profits) is 40% (not sure what figure actually is)

therefore profits are going to be around $1,250,000,000

$1,250,000,000 a year = $3,424,657 a day

How many casinos are there? - say 20 significant ones?

$3,424,657 / 20 = $171,232 each (7 days a week!!)

How many customers in each? - say 100 serious gamblers? - (more at weekends)

$171,232 / 100 = $1,712 per person lost.

And these figures only account for profits, add a significant amount more for turn over.

I think from these figures, if I was getting half a mil, I wold be a little 'coy' too.



Now, take the claimed annual tax of 500,000,000, and divide by the population of say 200,000, only equates to $2,500 per year to be spent per person, or $6.90 per day.

Not much for the people at all, unless my figures are flawed.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:27

Wow Brian, I'll take your word on those figures

Chessman


Joined: 13/05/2008
Posts: 486

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:28

Hi Mark



I am in splendid spirits, thanks.



Interesting topic this. I obviously knew it was big business in the TRNC but not this big. I have never been in a casino in my life so am not particularly knowledgeable on the subject. I wonder how this compares, per head of population to say, the US.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 13:35

Splendid - thats very upbeat Geoff. Glad to hear that.



I have been in many of the casinos. One of my friend loves them and I just watch him play. I think they are quite large but he thinks they are tiny in comparison to Las Vegas. I have never been to Vegas and certainly have no plans to go there.



What do you do in NC Geoff for a living? No problem if you don't want to answer. I wont be offended plus it takes the thread off track

Lambousa Gordon


Joined: 03/11/2007
Posts: 1992

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 14:04

Sorry Brian - your figures are completely out.



What Aydogan Bey said was that the casinos are directly charged some $75,000,000 per annum. This is via licence fees, stoppaj and sans oyunlari and other taxes.



We also contribute large Belediye charges and substantial social insurance, pension fund and payroll taxes. These, with other running costs make up a large proportion of the 500 million alluded to. There is also the knock-on effect of taxes and VAT collected from businesses that work with casinos such as hotels, victuallers etc, VAT on approximately 3,500 casino employees' personal expenditure. Also, the money injected through new investments, refurbishment etc and the taxes and customs duties that also attend those.



Frankly, I think that the sector contributes a lot more than $500million to the economy. Of the new hotels built in the last five years all have been built to obtain licences. For a 5* 250 bed hotel the investment is not less than $30million - in most cases mo

Chessman


Joined: 13/05/2008
Posts: 486

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 14:08

Hi Mark



I am an underwriter and Associate Director in the world of international commercial insurance. We don't write local insurance. Some people may regard insurance as gambling, so it is not completely off topic!

I worked as a Director of two companies in the UK and got fed up of the Welsh weather! Being here gives us a less parochial 'face' than the UK would.



I could give you the rest of my life story which would only take another sentence but I am off for a smoke! (outside with no one else in sight, I might add!)

Lambousa Gordon


Joined: 03/11/2007
Posts: 1992

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 14:10

... more.



What he and the entire sector is concerned about is being taxed out of business. Like all businesses in Cyprus we have seen our running costs sky-rocket in the past five years. What the casinos have also suffered is huge rates of tax increase - 200% in the last four years alone; and that on hard-currency as we are taxed in a combination of dollars and euros.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 14:26

Casinos then are a bigger money spinner than I had thought but the government are in danger of killing the goose.





Geoff, sounds perfect. Slightly less rain in Cyprus than Wales ;-)

brian24001


Joined: 23/03/2008
Posts: 606

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 14:27

Hi Gordon,

Figures are not meant to be representative of the contribution made by casions etc, just to show really how what looks initally like a huge sum actually equated to very little per capita. As you rightly say, being in a positon to know the figures very well, the whole sector provides hugely for the people of NC, and long may they continue to do so in providing much needed entertainment, but more importantly employment.

I'm not sure about the source of ILC's figure of 500mil, but if the figures are nearer your suggestion, then the total charges of 75mil equates to only $1 per person per day, or bugger all in English.

The real contributions as you say are the additionals, the employment, the wages that are then spent in the community, the service providers to the casinos (foods/drinks, stationary, clothing etc etc the list is huge).

However, 3,500 people at say GBP 30/day average only puts 38mil (plus tax/NI) into the economy.

We need to find minerals, and I don't mean ro

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 20:21

Suzanne,

I thought message 2 was a bit harsh on Mark.I enjoy reading his posts.He goes out of his way sometimes to pass on any information that he feels is important to all the members on here and i think you owe him an apology,

Regards,

Paul.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 20:50

thanks Paul - Glad you enjoy the posts. I will copy the posts from sites if I have time. It used to be much easier when there was no charachter restrictions.



No need for Suzanne to apologise. I didn't take offence, but thanks again Paul

Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 22:28

suzanne..How come you are still posting on here when you tell your friends on the other forum that you have been "kicked off" here. do I warrant an answer..

no1doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
31/10/2008 22:52

Thank you Suzanne, we're all refreshed and challenged by your unique point of view. I don't know what yourvproblem is but I'll bet it's hard to pronounce.Mark has made a very relevant post and whether he copied and pasted it us irrelevant. Well done Mark

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 01:46

hi to i lovecyprus, gordon and chessmass not forgetting suzanne do they equate the figure from isreal syriaia and of couse the gc gambling habits. i know they all want the big guys fron th uae but monte carle vagas etc will aways be the stamping ground. i dont think they loose money why are thet attached to otels so the hotel wins , if you ask e and know nothing about gambling but who really wins how can they pay for everything from flights, rooms food fags and booze not forgetting transfers in limo back and from airport how do they do that is it tax dodge gordon yo have so muckh knowledge but do you pay for all these things, per captia of trnc or turkey.

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 07:20

Lilli, real gamblers do not get satifaction out of winning... it's an odd psychological quirk that the real buzz comes from nearly winning.. which is why seriously wealthy gamblers don't and can't stop when they are ahead...



I'm talking about those who play on until they have lost large sums . Why, because winning simply does not slate their thirst...



To most people this will sound odd but then gambling your country's vast fortunes away would seem odd to us ordinary mortals...



Why would an oil rich Arab multi-billionaire be interested in gambling? Because they can't experience losing in any other walk in life... and they want to experience all of life's pleasures... "there's nowt queer as folk"

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 12:16

Go to any hotel in Cyprus have a look at their bar area count the number of people--not to busy, then go to their casino! Up to 200 people usually dropping and i have tried to work it out ,maybe i reckon £5000/£10000 every 10 minutes sometimes more. I would suggest your figures are on the low side , owners probably skimming. THERES A SURPRISE!

Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 13:34

Suzanne..Funny that is, cos the other lady said she posted here under the name of suzanne and if my memory serves right 2 people using the same nickname are not allowed.yousee the nickname I wanted to use is already being used...and I was asked to find another.Any explanations for that??

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 13:43

Of course when banned under one name changing it is a way to get back on...

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 16:12

I thought we were talking about casinos ? On the other hand if Suzanne is a HOT GIRL !!! i fully understand and apologies guys.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 16:19

karakum5c - at 47 I doubt she's a 'hot girl'. A warm mature woman maybe!!

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
01/11/2008 16:30

No1 Doyen--You are on very dangerous ground there my friend. A woman at 47 -is a woman of experience who knows all the right buttons to push and can drive a man wild with desire!