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EricCrapton
Joined: 30/12/2010 Posts: 325
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 15:16 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 1 of 38 in Discussion |
| A young friend of mine runs a successful care agency for the elderly/disabled back in the UK and is thinking of re-locating to North Cyprus. Thinking in terms of ex-pats, what would be his chances of setting up over here? Questions: Are there such agencies already over here? Would there be a market for a home care agency? Would he be allowed to set up such an ageny? Any thoughts on the matter would be greatly appreciated. |
nurseawful
Joined: 06/02/2009 Posts: 5934
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 15:20 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 2 of 38 in Discussion |
| Message 1 Can you e-mail of board at trnchealthcare@gmail.com Going out now but will answer later tonight. Chris |
moxie
Joined: 23/05/2009 Posts: 969
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 16:57 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 3 of 38 in Discussion |
| yes very much needed......there are Enghlish Turkish /Romanian care nurses also available ...they can also live in if needed |
martinD41
Joined: 06/09/2010 Posts: 3001
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 19:08 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 4 of 38 in Discussion |
| moxie....don't confuse live in "Carers" with trained Geriatric Nurses,there a world of difference ... |
tomsteel
Joined: 22/06/2009 Posts: 482
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 19:33 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 5 of 38 in Discussion |
| Msg 4 - why would anybody want a geriatric nurse to care for them - lol! |
Visitor
Joined: 19/08/2010 Posts: 492
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 19:37 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 6 of 38 in Discussion |
| Its a great idea. Remember many Cypriots return to retire too. Most of the staff in care homes these days are care workers - few are nurses. |
martinD41
Joined: 06/09/2010 Posts: 3001
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 19:55 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 7 of 38 in Discussion |
| msg5 sorry I should have said to moxie,don't confuse live in "carers" with nurses trained in Geriatric Care..lol.. |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 20:14 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 8 of 38 in Discussion |
| There are various stages: Sheltered accommodation and home care/emergency on call for active elderly and disabled Care home for frail and vulnerable Nursing /Convalescent Home Hospice which is your friend offering? I believe these is an increasing need for all with the increased immigration and gradual break up of the traditional Cypriot extended family. But the question was "would he be allowed to set up such an Agency?" I franky dont know. I hope someone here will be able to point you in the right direction to contact the appropriate Gvt. Dept. I believe it would help a lot if you could also get the support'/help/involvement of a Cypriot professional in the field and the assistance of a fluent Turkish speaker is virtually essential. |
cyprusbreeze
Joined: 20/08/2009 Posts: 91
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 20:40 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 9 of 38 in Discussion |
| Should think it is a great idea and would make someone a very good income if done properly. It is high on the list of concerns when retiring to any foreign country - hey - its high on the list of concerns in the UK too! |
Marion
Joined: 06/03/2011 Posts: 1816
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 20:43 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 10 of 38 in Discussion |
| Yea, but....... could we afford it. I have visions of my demise being in bed surrounded by cats and dogs and muck all on my own, because I could not afford to go into any c are home, nor afford a carer. does it worry me? Not too much because that is how it was years ago, BUT one had caring neighbours then annd everyone helped everyone else. Now it is all down to finance. But in terms of it being a business proposition here, there are already a couple of very small places doing just that and for people on adequate pensions it is a viable option. also hospices aare beingplanned for cancer sufferers, but no for geriatrics, nor indeed for anyone with say alzheimers who may not necessaryily be 'old.' So I would suggestt the person in question does a lot of market research themselv es. |
Marion
Joined: 06/03/2011 Posts: 1816
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 21:55 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 12 of 38 in Discussion |
| What a good point. Three years ago, and silence! Guess one may assume it did not turn out to be viable. Does anyone know? Or maybe it could be a warning to message no 1! |
Tango1
Joined: 19/02/2011 Posts: 1151
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 22:24 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 13 of 38 in Discussion |
| Lapta Old peoples Home is where about 44 locals go, but we Brits, well God only knows what will happen, and he's not being very informative at the moment. We don't have our extended families out here do we? |
Marion
Joined: 06/03/2011 Posts: 1816
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 22:33 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 14 of 38 in Discussion |
| No Tango 1, we don't, but bear in mind that the family system is starting to fail here. Mum;'s don't stay at home, but work and cannot take on the burden of old folk as well. Same thing is happening in China and other places where it was the norm that the ailing elderly were looked after by younger family members. all of us on Cyprus may well be faced with the same problem of being, as my beloved says'Not wanted!'./ Perhaps we should all get together and run our own loony bin for when we all have Alzheimers, but best arrange it before, as we won't remember what we planned to do! |
EricCrapton
Joined: 30/12/2010 Posts: 325
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 22:58 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 15 of 38 in Discussion |
| The work he does now is home care. Here is a link to his wesite: http://www.koscare.com/ 'But the question was "would he be allowed to set up such an Agency?" ' Yes, that is the burning question but I would think if it employed Turkish Cypriot workers it may stand a chance. I know of an english couple who managed to open a cafe serving the English population, i.e. English breakfasts etc. and they don't even employ locals. The main interest is, would there be a market for such a service? |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 02/10/2011 23:59 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 16 of 38 in Discussion |
| So it is basically a home care service. There are already agencies, voluntary and other, and I note Chris has suggested you contact her. But I believe there is room for more. There is also a question of location. I recently had problems getting help apparenty because I live west of Girne! and I dont know what facilities are available in, say,, Famagusa or Karpas. I would respectfully suggest that getting offical approval, finding suitable staff and the language problems should be addressed before raising people's hopes! It would also depend on cost - I doubt many people here could pay the type of fees charged in the UK for thi type of service |
philbailey
Joined: 17/01/2011 Posts: 3534
Message Posted: 03/10/2011 00:05 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 17 of 38 in Discussion |
| I thought most people returned to the UK for free health care |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 03/10/2011 00:07 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 18 of 38 in Discussion |
| Marion: Message l0. First para - again you took the words out of my mouth! Second para - I am afraid alzheimers or similar is a tragedy waiting to happen in the expat population. The trouble is caring is stressful requires special skills and is not as financially rewarding as caring for those who need some physical help. Also raises legal issues! Is , there , for instance , anything like The Court of Protection in the TRNC. In the absence of a close, willing and able relative, whom could one trust with an enduring power or attorney? |
mrsgee
Joined: 23/06/2009 Posts: 396
Message Posted: 03/10/2011 00:42 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 19 of 38 in Discussion |
| Message 17....having had first hand experience of the so called 'care' for the elderly in the UK - here at the moment trying to sort out something for 85 year old mother - I can assure you that it is anything but free.....is an absolute nightmare to put in place....problem probably made worse by cuts in NHS/Social services, and the fact that people are living longer and so create more need for a service which is crumbling.... If someone is looking to put in place a good, reasonably priced service....that actually works, in TRNC I can only say good luck to them....because it sure does not exist in UK, not in our area anyway. NHS is a joke these days, unfortunately, for those who are forced to experience it. |
moxie
Joined: 23/05/2009 Posts: 969
Message Posted: 03/10/2011 01:01 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 20 of 38 in Discussion |
| Martin i did not confuse anything! a basic kniowlege of medications is surely a no brainer ? ive had dealings with paid care here ..i did not even mention geriatric? carer be it, elderly ,infirm or disabled all means the same to me, its called assistance ...and so far ...not much luck!!! room for many more , but why is he asking on 44 surely go to the relevant authorities for the answers? going rate is £5.50 per hour Msge 15 ..he will not be serving cheese sarnies ....so why would he employ locals who are not qualified...first aid, ...knowledege of meds etc Yes there is a market.......make sure its legit and he employs qualified people ....im not sure if thats the case here at the moment ? |
Bertie
Joined: 15/04/2008 Posts: 155
Message Posted: 03/10/2011 10:48 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 21 of 38 in Discussion |
| To start any business here you have to be able to put a fairly substantial amount of money in the bank as security against defaulting against tax etc. I think if he is running a succcessful business in the UK he should stick to what he knows. I'm sure if he thinks the red tape is a minefield there in its own way it will be 100 times worse here. I do think the majority of x pats go home if they need care others can find local help, even trained nurses here earn a pittance. |
Jonesy299
Joined: 07/02/2009 Posts: 367
Message Posted: 03/10/2011 14:48 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 22 of 38 in Discussion |
| I would have thought if we have problems legislating estate agencies, building companies, management companies etc in TRNC (this Forum talks about almost nothing else at times) then legislating highly lucrative professional care homes for elderly people would be incredibly difficult - as recent news stories have shown we cannot even achieve this in UK across the board. |
madturk
Joined: 25/03/2009 Posts: 217
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 00:10 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 23 of 38 in Discussion |
| the basic uk carehome charges about £500.00 per week for an N H S person. its about £600.00 private. so maybe the way to go is to work with the nhs in the uk and if you can charge less than £500.00 per week they might even fund the costs as it will be cheaper than caring for them at home. the down side of private people , what do you do if their funds ran out. |
Marion
Joined: 06/03/2011 Posts: 1816
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 01:44 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 24 of 38 in Discussion |
| What do you do if you don't have the funds to start with? Maybe message no 1 needs to do some market research here, and before embarking on making a reality of this, find out how much they would have to charge for this home and then find out how many people will be able to afford it. No good creating the place to find you have only a couple of takers .How many people reading this thread feel they could or want to pay for this kind of care? and be honest so that our friend here can assess whether at the moment this would be a viable option. |
flowerfairy
Joined: 17/09/2008 Posts: 1277
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 08:47 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 25 of 38 in Discussion |
| The trouble with that one Marion is, if only we had a chrystal ball. How do you know if you'll be able to afford it until you get to that stage, as like all things in life, you never know what's around the corner. Basically I think it's a good idea, as what do we do when we get to that stage? Who will take care of us? I just pray to God, that I live long enough to find out. |
martinD41
Joined: 06/09/2010 Posts: 3001
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 12:18 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 26 of 38 in Discussion |
| "What do people do if their funds run out"? simple, they liquidate their assets.... |
moxie
Joined: 23/05/2009 Posts: 969
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 17:56 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 27 of 38 in Discussion |
| Marion ..the question was for home care... not a care home |
Hector
Joined: 26/08/2008 Posts: 2352
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 19:01 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 28 of 38 in Discussion |
| "What do people do if their funds run out"? simple, they liquidate their assets.... Fine whilst you still have money but the TRNC won't pay I doubt, for your care home when your money runs out as does the Local Authority in the UK. When my mother, bless her, was in care home it was 1500 pounds a week in outer London a couple years ago. |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 19:35 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 29 of 38 in Discussion |
| It appears we are talking about care in the home - NOT a care home. For a lot of people the former is far better and can delay the need for permanent full time care. They say they assess needs and I assume this will range from people who need daily help with say, dressing, to those who begin to feel vulnerable when they get older (may be living alone or with a frail partner) who just want the reassurance that expert help and support is in hand at the push of an alarm button if say, they had a fall. I believe there is a need for this, and it will increase as the expat population increases and ages, and I know of at least one Cypriot who would have welcomed something of that nature. I still think the major problem is staffing. Where would the staff come from and would they be able to train. |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 04/10/2011 19:39 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 30 of 38 in Discussion |
| Btw the Local Authority does not always come to the rescue in the UK. When more than a certain amount of nursing is needed, it is either a geriatric ward in an overcrowded and overworked NH hospital or the relatives have to find the money for a very expensive private nursing home. I know from personal experience. |
martinD41
Joined: 06/09/2010 Posts: 3001
Message Posted: 05/10/2011 22:20 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 31 of 38 in Discussion |
| What people forget is that Care Homes/or Home care, are not about Caring, they are about Huge profits ,it's a big money earner .My cousin started one 8 years ago, he is now very wealthy... |
EricCrapton
Joined: 30/12/2010 Posts: 325
Message Posted: 05/10/2011 23:59 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 32 of 38 in Discussion |
| Please forgive me but many people here are missing the point it seems. As some point out, it's home care and NOT a care home service that this thread is about. And this tentative inquiry is all about testing the waters/market research. |
flowerfairy
Joined: 17/09/2008 Posts: 1277
Message Posted: 06/10/2011 00:05 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 33 of 38 in Discussion |
| Care....., care home...., who has the chrystal ball to say that we will have enough savings to pay?, yes, it concerns me, of course it does, but until I reach the situation, how can I tell you that I can afford it? Who can? |
Marion
Joined: 06/03/2011 Posts: 1816
Message Posted: 06/10/2011 00:14 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 34 of 38 in Discussion |
| Point taken message 32. But either way i doubt I could afford it. Or put it another way, if I needed to pay someone for caring for my husband or myself (regardless of age, but of necessity) I could not afford it. to have someone come in say, twice a day, no doubt travel time/money would be added to the hourly rate of the carer and even at £5 an hour (say), you are looking at £70 a week, which for folk on a pension would be a lot.So when your friend does his market research, tell us what the cost owuld be today, and maybe we can say whether we think it would be something that would be good for us and create a good business for them. As it is, hooray for Nurse Awful and team. |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 06/10/2011 00:37 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 35 of 38 in Discussion |
| I doubt if you could get the info you are looking for on a forum. Some of us , knowing how poor the system can be in the UK or with doubts as to whether qualify or indeed want to return, may be putting money on one side (and doing without luxuries such as the deaded swimming pool! to manage it) but would hardly be prepared to say how much on a open forum , nor with the financial world the way is is whether anything will be left of our pensions and savings when real need arises. Nor do we know how long we are going to live - what would your friends do if someone paid say £70 a week for five years, then said sorry the money is all spent! OK for a short period, say someone needed help while convalescing after an operation, or while a broken limb is healing - but for long term care of aging people you need some kind of insurance scheme and these are too expensive. It is also open to abuse - will your friends be able to guarantee advantage wont be takenof vulnerable people? |
Cocklebay
Joined: 26/02/2011 Posts: 353
Message Posted: 06/10/2011 10:30 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 36 of 38 in Discussion |
| I have concerns about any care agency in the TRNC.How up to date are the carers/nurses in their training and knowledge? Are their qualifications enough evidence to allow them to set up these agencies. ( I know of one "carer" in the TRNC who claims to be a Staff Nurse, but to my knowledge her experience of caring was as a domicillary Care Assistant in the UK!!) I am also really concerned that there is NO REGULATION of these "services" Who do clients report issues to to etc!!!? I could go on and on but I will continue to have grave concerns about unregistered and unregulated services practicing in TRNC! |
Cocklebay
Joined: 26/02/2011 Posts: 353
Message Posted: 06/10/2011 11:01 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 37 of 38 in Discussion |
| There is also the question of CRB checks? (Criminal Record Bureau). How will these be done!?, and who will pay for these? Outdated checks cannot be proof of no CR, sorry but yet another concern!!! |
BizziLizzi
Joined: 02/08/2011 Posts: 855
Message Posted: 06/10/2011 11:20 | Join or Login to Reply | Message 38 of 38 in Discussion |
| Yes, and the TRNC do have Health and Safety Regs, Food Hygiene, etc. , maybe not as rigidly (some would say as stupidly) enforced as in the UK, but noneless compliance costs money .........and time! I dont want to be depressing about an initiative I would like to see prosper and might need in future, but it is better to be prepared. And as I said earlier what protection would there be for the mentally confused. I can foresee a lot of posts from this formum by people concerned about how their neighbours are treated! As I mentioned on anothe post ACE (Age/Concern) did a report on the problems of expat pensioners. Wouldnt it help to talk to them. |
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