Turkey Israel Greece and Russia

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 15:25

Are all involved in some way in the conflict in the med.Which way will the U.S.A. jump if the cat and mouse games that are currently taking place turn nasty,



Paul.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 15:36

USA will not allow Turkey to fight Israel at any cost. Against the others Turkey always gets the vote. The only way this will break down is if Erdogan is in complete control of the Army. Does anybody have any evidence to support such view.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 16:03

Hey Paul !



Have you any threads that are a bit more cheery ? ;)

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 16:06

Let's hope it doesn't come to that. (I'm referring to Pauls post)

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 16:21

YFred wrote: "USA will not allow Turkey to fight Israel at any cost."



That is very true but put it anaother way: "Will USA allow Israel to stand in the way of Turkey i.e. will USA alow Israel to help defend ROC". I am sure USA wil not allow that either because one follows the other.

ismet

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 17:21

There is no need to defend RoC becasue it will no be attacked. All Turkey has to do drill where it likes in the zone she claims which happens to include 90% of what RoC claims for herself.



That is rather unfortunate for the RoC.



In the meantime it is upto RoC to defend its zones it claims for herself. If Israel is allowed by the USA to join in such an event, then USA has lost control. Every man to himself as it were. But I fear Israel will not come top the aid of RoC their aim will be got grab as much as possible from the RoC in the guise of defending it of course

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 17:25

msg 6 YFred,

Very wise words, much the same as Britain got her "Sovereign Bases" for nothing

ismet

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 17:38

Ismet,



The bases are not free, our cousins in the south can't make up their mind about how much rent they would like to charge. Presumably the reason for that is that according to the constitution 30% will have to be given to the TRNC.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 17:54

YFred,

Surely there is a very big difference between "Tenants" and "Sovereign Owners". The Brits are not tenants on the bases, they are Soveriegn owners. Mark my word, they will even claim the gas and petrol found in the sea opposite Akrotiri and Dhekelia. Slowly slowly, no need to rush, unlike Turks, that is British foreign policy.

ismet

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 17:55

YFred





isn't it rather more a case of the UK not paying as the institution that was the RoC ceased to exist ?



All this armchair expert 'talking up' of a dispute isn't healthy.. one of us mild knock over our Horlicks..;)

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 17:57

I wa sunder the impression that they have been negotiating how much rent to pay since 1960 and have not yet reached an agreement. Have I got that wrong?



As to soverign rights, sure if RoC can claim thousands of KM sq sea bed south of Cyprus why not the bases. Interesting developments ahead then.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:00

6m's,



Hot choclate if you don't mind. Horlicks? never liked it. What exactly is it made of anyway.

russianbabe


Joined: 19/08/2011
Posts: 130

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:07

why is russia send an armada and an aircraft carrier to the med?

nato will not help turkey in case of war against israel ,isnt the mother of nato the usa?

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:25

YFred



>>Interesting developments ahead then.<<



this is a headline from 2007



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6366249.stm



"Turkey has warned Cyprus to cancel its tender for oil exploration and drilling rights off the divided island's coast."



Our Hot Chocolates and Horlicks will be dried out and very cold before much happens... something worth arguing about has to be found first ...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horlicks

tomsteel


Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 482

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:29

Who owned the land currently used by the British Sovereign Bases prior to 1960 when Cyprus gained independence? Whoever it was should be the receiver of rents due, maybe this is not the RoC Government. The SBAs were the subject of detailed negotiations prior to 1960 and agreed by ALL parties then. However, the UK Government did, yet again, fail in its commitment to honest foreign policy in the early 70s, resulting in this madness of a north-south divide.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:31

But what about the new tactic, drill where ever you want and so will we?



After all it is not Turkey that is saying it is all mine, it is the RoC. Where as Turkey just wishes to share, now isn't that turn up for the books. Turkey has just joined the liberal world and the RoC the fascist.

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:32

I suspect that Dikealya base is on Efkaf land, not not idea about Agrotur.

tomsteel


Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 482

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:35

How about the land at Ayios Nikolais, Episkopi and Troodos?

YFred


Joined: 06/05/2009
Posts: 1471

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:38

Trodos must be Government land. No body in their right mind would wish to live up there.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:48

http://www.google.com/url?sa=X&q= http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Turkey,-Israel,-Greece-and-Russia-mobilising-over-Cyprus-gas-22820.html&ct=ga&cad=CAEQAhgAIAAoATAAOABA8u6x9ARIAVAAWABiBWVuLUdC&cd=yHZkEhrxGl8&usg=AFQjCNF1_Y_bPqEctiorw-pRdmFgi9EVGw



Sorry Mark,



Re-mess 3,



Paul.

tomsteel


Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 482

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:49

Troodos is a highly popular tourist area.

newscoop


Joined: 23/12/2007
Posts: 2197

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:51

Look up your dictionaries guys;



Sovereign means total ownership.



Rent?



forget it.

tomsteel


Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 482

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:01

Then I ask myself why we pay rent for the bases in Gibraltar?

wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:09

Paul,



This seems to be getting out of hand. Relax mon ami! Storm in a teacup!



I see a solution to the Cyprus problem (as forecast 6 months ago)



Bubbles and TCs dancing in the streets! Its amazing what a change of fortunes, brings with it!.



Start saving to cover your bet 14YTL. Oh ye of little faith!



wyn

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:11

re msg 30, Paul



'apology' accepted.. ;)



Hardly ranks as 'big' news.. in your link.. Ah, well back to my Horlicks

nicola


Joined: 06/09/2011
Posts: 246

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:12

Once again Paul an excellent thread.



This situation is getting interesting, I do not think Turkey will be pushed around by the USA, unless they have been offered something by way of compensation.



Cue the mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm's with his superior knowledge of all things cypriot.

deputydawg


Joined: 30/03/2010
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:31

I expect the level of success or otherwise with the drilling for oil will determine the degree of conflict and also the number of interested entities willing to take up arms. In a word "greed" and the biggest bullies will prevail. The USA and Russia have never been shy in using military strength to steal what did not belong to them.

nicola


Joined: 06/09/2011
Posts: 246

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:33

Neither have the ROC, hence the Turkish peace mission.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 19:37

Cheers Nicola,re-mess 26,



Sorry again Mark i will come back with a show stopper i promise.Enjoy your horlicks,lol,



Paul.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 20:01

I can't remember the taste of Horlicks but why pay extra? I heat up some milk and add a small spoonful of locally made "Pekmez" made from carobs. Its delicious.

ismet

Sundance


Joined: 15/07/2010
Posts: 213

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 20:09

Paul all the threads you post are of great interest, don,t know where you finds the time to finds them,



Well done



Sundance

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 20:42

I have a secretary sundance,cheers,



Paul.

nicola


Joined: 06/09/2011
Posts: 246

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 21:21

Paul that's cheating ha ha ha

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 21:38

And fibbing as well,



Paul.

Clarissa2


Joined: 12/06/2009
Posts: 1476

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 22:43

Re: Msg 33,



Wait until he starts singing...

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 00:36

Just to make it clear to everyone;

The Sovereign Base Areas were created in 1960 by the Treaty of Establishment, when Cyprus, a colony within the British Empire, was granted independence.

For 4 years after Cypriot independence in 1960, the British government paid the Republic of Cyprus rent for the bases. After the inter-communal conflict of 1963-64 they stopped, claiming there was no guarantee that both communities would benefit equally from that money. The Cypriot government is still claiming money for the years from 1964 to now. Estimates for this range from several hundred thousand to over one billion Euros.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 14:29

Thanks for that BigOz. So they are Sovereign Bases but the land is either Public Land (which presumably belongs to the government) or they are individually owned. So if they use any of the individually owned land with the agreement of the owner they pay rent to the actual owner and I suppose the government used to get the rent for the publicly owned land.



Well, when you rent a place you should normally ask for references. Britain did rent Cyprus from the Ottomans but they stopped paying after the First World War. They have done it again after 1963. Serves Cypriots right for trusting the Brits as tenants

ismet

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 14:31

Hi Ismet,



The 'non credit worthy' Brits 'got' Cyprus due to an outstanding debt owed by a certain Sultan, no ?



What goes around ..and all that ? ;)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 14:37

Concerning the ways of The British Empire, I reserve the right to keep that part of the information for myself - for fear of offending our English friends in this forum

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 14:37

Hey Marky, you may be right about the debt because the Ottomans had been skint for too long but it was definitely a rental agreement and they paid for it. Maybe they were paying it against their debt.

ismet

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 15:11

Re-mess 35,



How do you know about my dulcet tones,



Paul.